A working theory on AP/OBE/NDE and the afterlife

Hey all,

I’ve been a lucid dreamer since an early age, about 4 years old I was having a recurring nightmare, which led me to discover the ability all by myself. I didn’t learn it was called lucid dreaming until much later in life. After learning it was called lucid dreaming, I soon discovered astral projection and spent many years practicing that.

I’ve always felt that reality is an illusion, like something is not quite right, like something is missing or out of place, it has just never felt solid or real to me. The only thing that ever felt real was my self, not my physical body but my self inside, which made me always question everything. When you are constantly questioning reality like this, it’s like performing a reality check all the time. It increased my level of awareness at all times and as a result I have lucid dreams regularly and naturally.

Anyway, to get to the theory…

In my opinion, there are many words used to describe the term astral. They basically all reference same thing, and the astral IS the afterlife, it IS heaven and hell, but you are the one who navigates through it.

Astral = aether, aetheric, aethereal, energy, energetic, psi, psionic, psychic, prana, pranic, quantum, qi, chi, ki, spirit, spiritual… The list goes on and on. Each of these words describe same thing… An invisible force which we can tap into consciously, a place we transition to, pass on to when we die, or when we project into it.

It’s written in books like the Tibetan book of the dead. Often the deceased will start on the ‘bardo’ where all their worst fears come to life (like hell right?) but if they can get past it, will move on to higher planes (more like heaven). The bardo in christian literature is called Limbo. NDE literature and accounts of OBE all point to it. The experience is both subjective and objective, often in NDE’s the person will float out of their body and transition on, pass on to another place, where their beliefs shape what they experience. We also release DMT (the spirit molecule) from our pineal gland (third eye) when we are born, when we die, and each night we sleep which is further evidence of this. And my own personal experiences and research suggests this to be true and correct.

My theory as well, is that we keep ending up back here in a new body, reincarnating over and over again, not so much because of karma, but because we can’t handle it well enough on the other side. If you die on the other side you end up here, die here and you end up there. Back and forth we go, across the veil of two worlds or states of being, until one day we can learn to stay on one side, or maybe even both at same time. On the other side, it can be more vibrant, vivid and more real than this side. Time over there is more fluid and malleable, hours can pass in just a few seconds compared to here, we move through time differently over there like in a dream you are just suddenly in a new scenario and skipping unnecessary parts of the experience.

I’ve heard enlightened masters say that when our body dies, we simply move into a new body. However, Being incarnated in a new body within the physical world means going through the process of death and rebirth, which on this side of the veil means growing up again from a baby to an adult. Science also tells us that energy cannot be destroyed, only transformed. So it all makes sense if you agree to the notion that we exist eternally as a living conscious being.

Try to think of it more in terms of subtle energy, it’s everywhere and everything, very hard to detect or even become aware of. Our subtle energy body is self-automated, running in the background on optimal or minimum power so we don’t usually notice or become aware of it. There are methods to increase the power level of your subtle energy body such as practicing meditation, conscious breathing (e.g. pranayama), taking substances, etc. But one has to become aware of it consciously, which is easier to do when the power level is increased.

I joined an astral projection meetup group one time, and they all spoke about it like they do it every single night. When I asked how they all do it so often, the one thing they said which helps the most, is doing pranayama breathing every night. I started practicing it, and even that same night when I tried pranayama breathing the first time, I had multiple vivid astral projection experiences.

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Hello Aeon234,

allow me two questions that came to my mind reading your post.

What kind of research did you? How did you set it up, what were your results and your conclusion? I am curious how one can reproduce your findings.

And the second question I am even more eager to ask. You describe a model that helps explain AP, the spiritual realm and life beyond our waking reality. I am encouraging you to think about the consequences that should unfold if you theory were true. What are the implications? How does it play out in everyday life? And most importantly: How can we use it to improve our own life and existence?

The reason why I’m asking is that we always seek to capitalize on our research results. And I don’t think that classical science and your private explorations must be treated differently. What do you think?

Hi Marvin,

It’s well known and documented that the pineal gland releases DMT at birth, death and each night when we sleep. The only other time it releases this substance is when taking psychedlics, DMT being one of them. I would argue there are other methods of releasing DMT intentionally, such as conscious breathing techniques (e.g. wim hof method, kundalini/dragon breath, pranayama etc.) and deep meditation.

It’s also well known and documented (not in scientific literature, but historical texts - buddhist texts in particular) that the pineal gland is the location of the third eye chakra. I could go much more into depth on this regarding the shape and function of this gland, how it works in conjuction with other parts of the brain and energy system but I won’t. It would take me too long and it’s better that people do their own research if interested in knowing more about this.

DMT is often called the spirit molecule, and one reason for this is because people often report communicating with spirits while taking the substance. The experiences are very common amongst individuals taking the substance, or taking ayahuasca. They often report seeing geometric shapes and patterns, going through a tunnel - this is called ‘breaking through’ and people often say in the tunnel they have no physical body and get the sense that they are the tunnel, that their mind and body has morphed into the tunnel as they are going through it. Having ‘broken through’ to ‘the otherside’ this is where they would usually encounter spiritual beings and receive healing or learn something of deep importance. The experiences differ of course, depending on method and dosage, set and setting but many elements remain similar across multiple accounts.

Many scientists and researchers simply chalk all of it up to pure hallucination, illusion or delusion, which is extremely irresponsible and ignorant of them. It’s absolutely absurd to assume this considering so many accounts of similar aspects across accounts from multiple people. This suggests the experiences are real, because if it was just an illusion then the chances of common themes would be highly unlikely. You could say the same about NDE experiences, as many of these accounts share common similarities as well.

Furthermore, many of the prescribed medications used today in mental health are derived from experimentation with psychedelic substances, namely LSD and shamans in the amazon have known about the spiritual aspect of all this for many years. They’ve recently discovered a variation to the DMT molecule, known as 5-MeO-DMT, which many refer to as “the god particle” instead of “the spirit molecule” because when taking it, often people report an experience where they become God, they become all that is and see everything from a different perspective or vantage point, they see how everything is connected and the all is in everything, and because of this they are the all. When the trip ends, they come back to reality as themselves of course but with much greater understanding about the truth of reality.

Anyway, moving on to your other questions…

“What are the implications?”
The implications are that death is not the end, and we need not fear death because we are eternal, consciousness survives death. The only thing to fear would be any pain encountered during death, but not death itself. Another thing to fear of course in my opinion, might be the bardo state if you end up there first instead of straight into a heavenly realm. One would have to face their own fears, otherwise they might just end up back in waking life as a newborn baby, having to go through the entire process again.

“How does it play out in everyday life?”
Often I try to find the meaning behind certain English words, english itself is very limiting in expression with many words meaning same thing or sounding similar. However, most words can be traced back to greek or latin origin, and some words seem to carry other meanings. For example take the word Dream:
D = Death/Dying
R = Reborn/Rebirth
E = Eternal/Ethereal
A = Always/As
M = Man/Many
Another interpretation is this: Death REborn AM
So in everyday life, each night when we sleep we are going through a process of death and rebirth, perhaps not as final as death, but remember many people use the phrases “my relative passed away” or “they passed on” so when we die we are transitioning to somewhere or becoming something else. This is where that “Energy cannot be destroyed, only transformed” comes into play.

You might then ask, what’s the difference between dreaming and astral projection?
I would suggest that when we dream, our energy body is active but we aren’t very aware of it and don’t use it to move around, instead we just stay in the same area. We project a dreamworld into our own area of space, without moving outside of that area. It’s like personally projected spatial area that we can have our own dreamworld and freedom in. Astral projection or OBE on the other hand, we become aware of the energy body, and use it to move and travel to places, the physical body being our anchor and portal, but the energetic body the vehicle for moving around. In an NDE, the physical body is technically dead and lifeless, so the energetic body has no choice but to move and travel elsewhere, and can also do this much more freely because it no longer has a tie to the physical world.

“How can we use it to improve our own life and existence”
I see it like this, we need to become lucid after death, we need to realize we are dead after dying and have enough control to be able to defend ourselves if we enter the bardo/limbo or be able to navigate to better places. It all works similar to lucid dreaming, there is a conscious aspect that drives our experience of it all, things like belief, expectation and intention all important skills not just in lucid dreaming but in astral projection and death. It could improve our own life and existence, by knowing death isn’t the end, it free’s a person up so they are not as fearful or racing against time to accomplish things. My thoughts are we are continually going back and forth across the veil, stepping between two worlds again and again, until we can either stay in one of them forever, or perhaps even move freely between the two, or have one foot in each at same time.

Sorry if this post was long, thought I’d at least explain it all in detail…

Thank you for the elaborate response, I appreciate you took your time to write it.

So if I understand you correctly, the dream world, the astral projection plane, the afterlife etc. are all one and the same place, an aetherlike sphere?
If that is so, according to your theory what is the reason that we as humans can interact with each other so easily in waking life/reality but in dreams at least this doesn’t seem to be the case? I’ve been recording dreams for 15 years with something worthwhile recording almost every night, yet my observation is that I seem to be alone in my dreams. And lucid dreams seem to make it even worse, because in those my consciousness is in stark contrast to all other inhabitants of the dream world who don’t seem to be conscious or linked up with anyone or anything on any other realm.

Another question that came to my mind: It is apparent that your theory applies to human beings. How about other entities, e.g. animals? I noticed a lot of parallels between your theory and the teachings of Buddhism. I’m far from an expert on the latter topic, but if my memory serves me right, the eternal cycle of transmigration (Samsara) involves all animals just as well as humans. So I’m curious about the details according to your theory. :slight_smile:

Hey Martin,

Yes, that’s essentially what I’m saying that they are all the same place like an aetheric sphere as you call it. It applies to all humans, and animals, anything that is living - reality itself is conscious, conscious awareness serves as the foundation for experience and perception, even a rock is conscious but to a different degree than we are as humans. We were once single celled organisms that became more complex and even today we are just one big organism made up of bacteria and the elements of nature. The universe is an even bigger organism, even planets and the sun can be seen as living conscious beings, but people fail to see it this way as the science is lacking in this area. Unless you are open minded, you won’t see it this way and having a closed mind also closes your mind off to perceiving anything outside of your box or comfort zone.

It’s a bit strange you have been recording dreams for 15 years and not had a single experience of shared dreaming or interaction with intelligent beings. Have you had transcendental dreams before? or ever meditated in a dream? or been to heaven and met God?

I experience this sort of thing often to the point where I can instantly tell if I’m dealing with a dream character or an intelligent living being. There are techniques that can be used to cross the boundary of personal space into astral shared space. One such technique is moving in any direction extremely fast. If you run, jump, fly (or teleport) fast as you can straight ahead or straight up, chances are you end up in a different scene or notice scenery change and start seeing some weird things and encountering other beings. It’s like the bubble of personal space can’t keep up with how fast and far you are going, or like your expanding the bubble of personal space so it bleeds through into astral territory zone.

Intention is a super-power, not just in dreams and the astral but real life too, one might argue it’s the most potent and powerful tool at our disposal. Using intention, you can control things just through sheer thought alone in a lucid dream, so this is another technique of getting into that astral zone just by intending it.

Although I appreciate buddhism and many other religions, there doesn’t seem to be one that fits my belief system. The closest one is pan-spiritualism, it’s fairly accurate but I’m not 100% sure it’s entirely accurate with absolutely certainty. I’ve done much research into many different area’s over the years, there are truths in every religion, but it’s often difficult separating truth from fiction. I’ve had tons of spiritual and paranormal experiences in the past, I have them regularly because my mind is open and it’s something I strive to achieve on a daily basis, and with just intent this can be a possibility for anyone wishing to experience it. When I do my research, I correlate it back to previous experiences and check within myself to see if it resonates as true, similar in a way to dousing or muscle testing but basing it on memory as well.

Because I’ve spent so long doing this, finding pieces of the puzzle and putting them together, I’ve become a jack of all trades and master of the most important one which is myself. Knowing thyself is the most important thing one can do in life, as we always experience things from the perspective of ourself, and can’t help others unless we first help ourselves. Many philosophers in history point to it as the source of all wisdom, achieving what buddhists call Samadhi through meditation can lead to knowing thyself much deeper and I’ve done this a few times now with consistent meditation practice. Some where along the line I started seeing that everything in reality is based on perception, without perception you don’t experience anything, and the things you do experience all stem from a single point of perception from which the self exists as “I AM”.

I know it’s been a while since you posted this, and I’m not sure how active you continue to be in this community, but this post felt like reading the transcript of my own inner narrative re: my spiritual journey. It sparks many questions that I’d be excited to have a chance to discuss with someone who has a similar perspective.
For example, I had a very intense trip on the drug salvia, which is in the same class as DMT, only not produced naturally in the human body. I had the experience of “breaking through,” and it’s difficult to put my experiences on the other side of that veil into words, though I am trying to further explore them through such psychic exercises as lucid dreaming and other trips into the subconscious and the power of the mind.
The physiological affects of salvia have also been shown to parallel the neurological and neurochemical activity that occurs during death, and that, in addition to the many lives I led and deaths I died in the (apparently, in linear time) 5 minute space that I was under the influence of the drug, leads me to consider this more of a near death experience than anything, one which has had a profound affect on my understanding of life and death, and the nature of reality. I am curious to whether, if in the time elapsed, you had done any other exploration or research into other drugs that have such effects, as you mentioned ayahuasca and DMT.
Additionally, what do you know about, and what is your take on quantum suicide? That is one thought experiment that, in classic fashion, both serves and disservices my theories.
Lastly, you briefly made mention of your own belief system in your most recent post. Your mention of pan-spiritualism got me curious as to whether you’d done any research on chaos magick, and if so, what your take is on the concept. If that’s a totally new term to you, although I doubt it, there is a super well illustrated and far-spanning guide available for free on the internet - however, it’s pretty dense for that reason, should not be treated as comprehensive, and I don’t know that it ever actually acknowledges the fact they’re talking about chaos magick, so one would have to already be privy to that fact were they to try and use it to wet their appetite for the concept.

Hey Boy,

I’m more frequent on dreamviews than here, lately I’ve been getting away from technology as much as possible - it free’s up a lot of my time and allows me to be outside in nature or out socialising and making new friends, instead of achieving practically nothing just staring at a screen all day every day…

I did pretty much every narcotic/psychedelic you can think of in the past… that was over a decade ago. It landed me in the mental ward with psychosis - people often say going through psychosis IS a spiritual awakening… it’s a process of death and rebirth like a snake shedding it’s skin or a phoenix being reborn from the ashes. I went through psychosis a number of times over the years, each time losing myself, losing my personality and ego and having to build myself back up like humpty dumpty. The last episode was approx. 7 years ago and it took many years to put myself back together after that one. I’m very mentally stable now, probably more so than you’re average person I can tolerate stress extremely well, and I finally figured out how to incorporate my spiritual side without it affecting me in regular waking life. I’m doing the best I’ve ever done my whole life… I’m fit and healthy, eating good food and about to change career and move house, good times ahead for sure!

But yes, getting back to your question… I’m aware of the whole ‘magickal mindset’ and ‘order through chaos’ and dabbled in a few different types of magick - white magick, sigil magick, high ceremonial, enochian, etc. I haven’t heard the term “quantum suicide” what do you mean by this?? I’ve said to my mate before that we are just an entangled quark in a perpetual state of self-reflection *sounds complicated but makes sense… infinite potential like we are God incarnate experiencing reality from multiple perspectives and vantage points. All is one, everything is connected.

There is so much I could delve into and explain in further details, I’ve spent over 20 years researching things and become so awakened that now if I want to know anything I just go within and ask spirit for answers. People think consciousness is the foundation of reality but they are wrong, spirit permeates everything and it animates consciousness, it gives rise to conscious awareness, and we all come from spirit. These days I am so heart centered that my mental chatter is non existent and I just let spirit move me where-ever it wants to, it’s like I am there to witness and just enjoy be-ing while spirit moves through me and takes me to the places I am needed most.

Anyway, the one thing that helped me significantly is conscious breathing… like pranayama style just keep doing it and always breathe consciously take in all the chi and prana/.etheric energy in the air and move it around inside yourself. Usually we breathe subconsciously - subconscious is another way of saying “automatic” like if we repeat a behaviour often enough the conscious mind puts it on auto-pilot. So you need to take everything off auto-pilot, to become aware and awake instead of asleep and drifting aimlessly through life. The more you intentionally re-take control of your own breath, and start doing things with purpose, the more beneficial it will be for you and your life can turn around instantly.

Good luck on your journey bro! Peace, namaste, love & light <3