Two and a half hours of sleep paralysis but no LD!

So if that wasn’t SP, that still leaves me with the question of my HI wasn’t progressing at all during that time period. Should I be TRYING to fall asleep in the beginning of WILD or what?

Cause I was under the impression that the goal was just to relax and that eventually your body would sleep.

I find that consciously trying to fall asleep isn’t very good, it leaves you tense and with expectation. But, also, you shouldn’t try WILD just at any moment, try it after a long and tyring day, or at least in a moment that you are very sleepy.
Also, did you try other techs? Don’t completely get your focus on only one tech when your beginning. See what works best for you, THEN you stick with it.

Well, like I said before. I tried LDing a while back and then gave up. I’d been trying to do MILD and VILD but they weren’t working.

So now I decided to go with WILD. I think I’ll restrict my WILD’ing to afternoon naps when I am usually more sleepy. We’ll see how that works out.

Thanks for the advice!

You say that your HI isn’t progessing, my guess is that it would be one of two things, number one is that you are thinking about falling asleep as this tends to inhibit sleep, secondly you could be thinking too much and too actively. Btw if you are truly in SP just “get up” out of your body and ,viola, you are in a lucid dream.

But my problem is that if I don’t focus/think actively, then I just drift into daydreams and just random jumbled thoughts. And those daydreams/random thoughts always lead me to sleep without an LD.

I don’t understand how I can try to fall asleep and stay awake at the same time. In other words, at what point do you stop trying to fall asleep and start trying to stay awake/WILD?

Keep in mind that there are different ways of doing WILD, and some may work better for you than others. I barely ever get hypnagogic imagery - but I can still WILD by paying attention to other senses. What I do is count backwards from 100 to 0 again and again while listening to that high pitched ringing in my ears (which is the auditory equivalent of hypnagogic imagery). Eventually, my mind gets really bored and I start to drift off - only to snap back with an electric vibration. Over time, those vibrations build up to fork-in-an-outlet level, and I can just stand up and start dreaming…

But there’s an infinite number of ways to approach it… For example, some people do tactile techniques like imagining that they’re jumping on a trampoline. I’m just saying you might have better luck with a non-visual one.

I think it’s better to fall asleep and miss a lucid dream, then to lay awake for hours and hours like that…

As Dunlar said, try focusing on other senses but the imagery. I, personally, focus on my body or on “nothing”, just stay focused, cleaning my mind of those random toughts, try doing the same and try focusing on different things. Tryal and error is all you can do to find what works best for you.

Acctually, that ringing isn’t auditory hallucinatios, it’s tinnitus

Cool, sounds good. I’m gonna try the focus on the body thing and let you guys know how it works out.

The sound thing sounds(no pun, lol) a little too advanced for me…

As Genki said the reining in your ears is not HH, but tinnitus. Also HI is not streaks of color on a dark background, but faces, or compleat pictures. It can be stills or movies. Some people can enter the HI to start an LD, others have to just let it pass befor they come to the point of having an LD.
One of the hardest parts of WILD is learning how “awake” and how “asleep” you have to be to get into an LD. There is a lot of info. about this in the sticky WILD topic.
WILD can be very dificult for people that do not fall asleep fast. If you do not normaly fall asleep fast, then you will spend hours trying to WILD. You might be better off with MILD, or a different DILD tech.

On the other hand, sometimes when I decide to give WILD a try I fall asleep so fast, that it’s almost like being shot dead. That’s perhaps too fast falling asleep :smile:


It sounds to me like a very relaxed state as well. I experienced this myself during my first tries.
When at the day do you attempt WILD anyways? It is nearly impossible for most people to WILD at the beginning of the night. You need atleast 3 hours or so of sleep, which is due to the fact that you dont experience much REM sleep during the early part of the night.

I myself do it in early morning…

That is untrue… HI usually starts with just some faint shapes or colours, which sometimes progress into complete pictures. HI can also be be split second flashes of images as well.

WILD at early night is impossible if you “master” it…

You don’t need REM to LD.

I’m aware that it can be called Tinnitus - but that isn’t as descriptive for most folks. Do I get an award for using 4 quotes in a row? :tongue: And I think Yang meant that it’s possible, not impossible. I didn’t want to use another quote, though…

Yep, I meant it IS possible.

It’s saddening that most peeps go all like “You should always attempt WILD only with WBTB!”

I never said it was impossible. But it is much much harder for the average person.
So why recommend the hard way? You can always try WILD before sleep once you have mastered WILD the easy way. If i tried to WILD for months-years in evening and failed, then i would probably have given up at the end.

I hope this was not aimed at me? As i have never ever mentioned anything about the WBTB method. WBTB involves waking up and staying awake for a certain time of the day. Waking up and go straight for WILD has nothing to do with the WBTB method.

Do you have any facts on that? I have never heard of anyone proving that they can be lucid during deep sleep.

No, it was not aimed at you.

Do some research, use google. REM is not needed. I don’t have to prove anything.

I don’t like debates, so. it’s seems like you and I always get into arguements.

Im having some of the same problem, only that i actually give up after half an hour :razz:

What shoul i concentrate on ?

I tend to lay watching my eyelids hehe

When doing that i see colored dots and strings there, and sometimes i have HI i think, which is like a faint picture.

and the picture mainly just faints away.

Any tips ?

Ok, I will try to clear up some things here.
First HH is not just any hallucination, if it was then it would not have a special name. HH happens when you are on the threshold to sleep. colours and flashes of light are just a sign that you have your eyes closed long enough that the light reception nerves in you eyes start producing random signals. HH is when the brain starts adding information to make complete pictures. This is the beginning of the transition phase to sleep, when the brain make up everything. Up to this point they are just random signals. It is the same with tinnitus. Lots of people have tinnitus while they are awake. It does not have anything to do with HH. HH is sound that makes sense, like words. Flashing lights and loud tinnitus tend to come just before HH, but that is because you are very relaxed. In a relaxed state, with your eyes closed and in a quiet room, you become more aware of these things. It is a sign that you are getting relaxed enough for WILD, but it is not HH.
As for WILD and WBTB. It is defiantly easier to do WILD with WBTB or with naps. Some people can have dreams in non-REM sleep, but they tend to be less vivid, and fuzzy. Remembering dreams that happen early in the night is also more difficult. Dreams that come later in the night tend to erase the memories of earlier dreams. That means that if you do WILD when you go to bed you should try to wake up right after the dream so that you can remember it. ( most people who start out with WILD at night say that they can’t wake up during the night and that is why they do not want to do WBTB. ) You will probably have fuzzy LD’s if you remember them, and you will be doing a lot of work for this without even knowing if you can WILD.
Because of all of that, for beginners that have not had a LD yet, I will continue to say that they should not start with WILD when they go to bed. That is kind of like saying “I have heard that mountain climbing is lots of fun, I am going to try to climb Mt. Everest.” Even if a person can do WILD at bedtime without WBTB, they should probably not start with that. There is someone who is right now posting that he has been trying WILD for 7-8 months without success. There are easier ways for beginners to learn LD’ing. I think that it makes more sense to suggest that they try something that gives easier faster results. After they know that they can LD, then they can work on the more difficult techs. and see if they work for them.
I also admit that there are people who can do WILD within the first week of trying, but there are not very many of them.

I just meant that i find no scientific evidence backing this up. I know a few people claim they have non REM dreams, but how do they know for sure that it is not REM? I am not saying it is impossible, but i really find it hard to believe that you can be conscious during a period where you brain is nearly inactive.

And no, i dont want to debate this either as i have no proof either. :smile: I was more in debate mood about recommending WILD before sleep or after.