Dream Interpretation - a made-up phenomena?

the Stuff Dreams are made of...
1

Hey everyone, this is my first topic. I’m new to the forums, but not to the idea of lucid dreaming. Thanks for taking the time to read my questions and thoughts.

Now, dream interpretation. I don’t understand how someone on a website, or on a dream symbol dictionary or anything like that can tell you what your dream means.

Lets say I have a dream:

A dog chases me around the backyard before climbing up a tree and then proceeds to throw apples at my face until I feel like crying.

What I don’t understand how someone can look up dog (symbol for friends and friendship) chasing (symbol from hiding away from emotions) tree (symbol for wisdom and superiority) and apples (symbol for love and deception) and the apparent meaning for their dream.

My dream means I am upset or afraid of what will happen if I profess my secret love to my crush, who just happens to be my best friend.

Note: All above symbols are made up.

How can all those symbols listed in dream interpretation books be correct for everyone? Do we, as humans, have a collective unconscious, so all the symbols in our dreams have the same meaning?

And then, if that’s assumed as true (collective unconscious) - how in the world do people come up with meanings for each animal and event in dreams anyway? Are they just lying or making it up? Seeing as you cannot prove dreams as having any inherit meaning or, if they have meaning, not being able to accurately determine that from mere symbols without further psychological analysis for each individual - the dream interpretation by symbols method seems shady to say the least.

Are those booksellers/authors who claim to know the meanings of symbols hacking into a scam in a readily-believable niche market?

Yes, I know dream interpretation is fun and sometimes taken lightly by many, but some take it seriously. I probably would not be exaggerating if I said thousands of people would be angry and upset over purchased books if they knew their meanings have no foundation or reasoning.

And if, say, personal dream interpretation was viable - that is, self-symbolism or finding the meaning according to your current stance in life - isn’t that just the same as looking at your life and trying to figure out what’s wrong or right with it? Or going to a psychologist and asking for an opinion while you explain your circumstances? It’s just the same.

Theoretically speaking, if our unconscious/subconscious mind is influenced by our waking periods, how would reaction and meanings to life be any different to those of the conscious mind? Just because we can not always access our subconscious does not mean they hold extra meaning or anything mystical like that, or that it is anymore insightful than our conscious.

Yes, personal dream interpretation may provide some answers to your mind and unconscious, but it’s just an extra step or gateway in the methods of mediation and counselling and nothing more than that.

All I really think dreams should provide is the basis of which to work on psychology and counselling.

For instance…
(M = me, P = psychologist)

M: I dreamt of apples and I felt scared.
P: Why did you feel scared?
M: I dunno. I’ve always had a irrational phobia of fruit though.
P: Why?
M: I was poisoned when my Mum forced me to eat a rotten banana when I was little. We were short on food and that’s all we could afford.

And so we lead into the final stages of therapy.
Hypothetical me has not coped with the depression of poverty and it’s effects on my life. Now, rather than meaning love, the apple is an actual memory of my childhood. See how the dreams provide, not the meaning, but in reality, the trigger? The emotions (fear) are more important than the symbols themselves. If I dream of apples after my session and feel happy during my dream, wouldn’t that suggest an improvement in my condition?

All further insight and personal anecdotes are highly appreciated.

This topic is not intended to be pejorative.

Thanks everyone again. Ethan.

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But why can’t we take on the role of psychologist ourselves? I think it’s fun to ponder on dream symbolism but I wouldn’t depend on dream dictionaries etc. Plus on a forum like this, someone other than the dreamer may spot something in the dream and the comment will resonate with the dreamer. But at the end of the day the only person able to Interpret your dreams is yourself :content:

edit :shy: I was so busy replying i forgot to welcome you to the forum Ethanescence, so …
:welcome: to LD4all :grin:

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Yeah, I agree. If dream interpretation is going to be attempted, it should be more like a community of friends helping you understand it or even better, a self reflection.

Thanks for the welcome. :smile: I think I’m going to like it here at the forums.

is going to go to bed early tonight so I can start my DJ
:cloud9:

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Welcome Ethanescence!

My Aunt has the book “10 000 Dreams Interpreted”. She treats it like a bible and says that it has helped her to understand her dreams. I think she has read the book so many times that it has been absorbed by her sub-conscious. So if she has a dream of a particular animal, weather event, etc. her mind creates something from her memories of the dream book with which she can then use to interpret and understand.

I still feel the best person to interpret your dreams is yourself. Of course it is also great to have friends like here on the forums to help point out something you might have missed.

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The problem when talking about dream psychology is that it is dependant on ones point of view. It is fine to talk about making an interpretation of your own dream but if you have no base from which to do this then you’re not going to get very far.

What dream dictionaries do is correlate the broader meanings to a very limited number of symbols. What we can then read as the ‘collective consciousness’ is no more than the shared understanding of signs and signifiers. If one does not subscribe to those interpretations then thier meaning is not lost, it is simply not applicable to you. A person utilising a dictionary of this sort would, by and large, pick and choose the relevance of meaning with regards to themselves.

The concept is academic though since dreams can encompass a vast spectrum of experience and there is absolutely no way in which even an encyclopoedia collection of dream dictionaries could cover every eventuality and it will always be necessary to delve into the psyche in order to fully interpret ones dreams.

I don’t use this kind of book myself. I tend to plump for the, “So tell me a bit about youself.” and “So what do you think it might mean?” routes during interpretation and I think you are totally right in saying that a Psychological approach is ultimately more productive, however not everyone wants to delve into their deepest depths just because they had a whacky dream. :tongue:

I personally reckon that those books and sites etc. should have a disclaimer on them. Something like, ‘This book cannot solve all of your lifes problems’. Having said that though, they do provide a good starting point and can encourage people to think for themselves, I mean it’s never long before you read an entry that makes you utter the immortal words, “Yeah, right! Whatever!” :gni:

Oh and BTW :welcome: what a great way to start your tenure. :clap:

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The symbols in the books are just based on some popular cultural symbolism. It varies from country to country, and person to person too. So the symbols are merely suggestions. You can apply them to real life as well and find meaning in your existance, if you start to think symbolically about everything. (And you might if you take a literature class.)

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Thought I’d covered that with ‘signs and signifiers’ :razz:

:cool:

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Wow, and here I thought I was the only one who couldn’t stand dream interpretations. I really don’t feel dreams are always(RARELY) “symbolic”. That’s just me though.

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I don’t think it’s just you! In fact, I know so, because I don’t think dreams are “symbolic” either. By which I mean that I don’t believe that dreams are cryptic messages from our subconscious. Perhaps “symbols” may occur here and there, that can give us a clue about something hidden in ourselves. But I doubt they are deliberate or even consistent, if they are there at all. We must not read too much into things even though it can be fun.

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Well, a dream dictionary is just a guide. And it should be approached as one. Everyone is different and dream symbols represent different things. You should take the dream dictionary and look at the entries as just possible meanings. You should look at your dream and find how it relates to your life. That’s the key.

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Hi and welcome. :smile:

I will give you a real response tomorrow but for now a lot of dream interp was based of S.Fruad (SP) and has evolved from there, its quite interesting to read about it and it was such a strange idea for his time, but he shaped psychology. Most of the dream interp books you buy today have his influence, from teeth falling out to the colors, most of his ideas where supressed sexual emotions or wish fullfillment and they sure dont bear much relevance on todays society.

I will give you a few web links and books that you might be interested in and will go further in deapth tomorrow but for now welcome and good luck.

Happy Dreaming

Richard