Esoteric Christianity … ianity.htm … /Trans.htm

I beg that anyone on these boards that believes they are a Christian to read about Esoteric Christianity and The Gospel of Thomas.

opening your heart to Jesus is not a shortcut to enlightenment.
A lot of Christians think that by admitting they are a sinner and accepting Jesus as there Saviour is going to get them into heaven.

you have to work just as hard as anyone to reach a higher consciousness!

Jesus provided teachings of spiritual awareness. he didn’t abolish all your sins so you don’t have to do any work.

flaming is not allowed on the forum. read the guidelines :moogle:

Blind Faith is how a large number of people are controlled by a small number of people.

salvation is personal and found through introspection.

Hehehe. Everyone isn’t blindly following their faith, though, just as everyone isn’t walking blindly through life. If all of the Christians on this site really were blind, close-minded fools, do you think we would be on reading about lucid dreaming?

You didn’t say it exactly, but what I understand your point to be, is that people should follow their faith while keeping logic and reason in mind. That was what the Pope said earlier this year, basically, during his speech in Germany. And you are right about that, it is stupid to follow something straight out without thinking about it, without using your brain in any way.

In actually, one of the main reasons why Jesus existed was to die for our sins. It is one of the main concepts of Christianity.

my point was that mainstream Christianity doesn’t follow the authentic teachings of Jesus it follows the teachings of kings whose interest was to remain king. my point was that Christianity was deformed by rulers into a state religion. Kings claiming to be second to god. A tradition still carried out today by George Bush.

We do not become Christs (Christos) because he was that. We shall never become it simply by believing that he was that, or that he did all that the Gospels record; or that he did something for us which washes away our sins and gives us a short cut to eternal bliss. No. We shall only achieve the same likeness when ‘that same mind’ (or ‘word’) which was also in Christ Jesus has been ‘brought to birth’ in us also, i.e. when we have realized that we, equally with him, are essentially divine in our deepest nature; that we are, equally with him, ‘sons’ of the same ‘Father,’ and are thus able to manifest as he did that divinity in our very humanity."

Jesus dying for everyones sins is a concept of a king not of Jesus.

jughand … I suppose you have read the forum guidelines and are aware that it is against them to try to convert other LD4all members to a different religion?

I wasn’t trying to convert anyone, I just wanted to spark some discussion on some very important spiritual matters . Everybody knows that holes can be shot throught the bibles hypocrisy, but it also has some amazing wisdom in it. which to some is very puzzling. man I thought this forum was open minded to debate and/or criticism.

is nobody interested in the truth?

although somethings I said may against forum rules, that doesn’t make it an unreasonable argument.

sorry for waking anyone, you can go back to sleep now, just go to sleep.

You mean Divine Right of Kings? When has George Bush claimed that he was selected by God to rule over others? lol! Oh brother…

Interestingly, Jesus WAS known as the King of Kings.

In any case, whatever you believe, thats fine, just please dont force it down my throat. It shows disrespect to what I and billions of others believe.

George Bush has said that he gets guidance from God.

Jesus being known as the King of Kings gives other Kings the divine right to rule? is that what your saying?

I apologise for offending what billions of people believe
but both Jesus and Paul taught that religion is not mere belief in doctrines but practical knowledge (gnosis) of the way to regain one’s birthright as a “Son of God” through a radical transformation process.


I thought that King of Kings bit was pretty witty. Hahaha, lighten up man. In any case, I still do not understand how Jesus dying for everyones sins is a concept of Kings. My point was essentially this: Jesus taught that he died for everyones sins, and because of that, and because he is considered to be the King of Kings, subsequently what you said was partly correct, but also contradictory.

George Bush isnt exactly a King now, is he? He doesnt have the crown, the scepter, or even the robe.

George bush is a ruler isn’t he? King, President, Its a different name for the same title.
the point is that they control a large number of people.

read the Gospel of Thomas and/or that link I have on esoteric Christianity.

The Gospel of Thomas was not accepted into the New testament.

I know its against forum rules to try and convert anyone, but I follow Buddhist teachings, and although I respect the teachings of esoteric christianity, I am not in fact an esoteric christian.

Certainly. But some would say what is Christianity today is mearly a corruption of that base esoteric and perenial philosophy, That was supposedly the key belief of Heirophants of Egypt and the core of the Vedanta scripture the basis for alot of Neo-Platonic philosophy. Theosophy too, of course comes from this same root, If you know if it.

You stated that George Bush says that he gets guidence from god. I don’t neccesarily believe that has anything to do with a claim to having divine right over others. Many christians would say they get guidance from god, especially through prayer.

Wait…you aren’t Esoteric? Then why did you bring it up? You’re trying to convert people to a religion you don’t follow yourself? …



So, what is the point of this article? If a religion isn’t good enough for you, and yet you push it to me…why should I convert?

Exactly. And Islam argues that Christianity was originally Islam, but it was corrupted by man.

I don’t call myself esoteric Christian, that doesn’t mean I don’t respect and find truth in those teachings. and must I repeat again I am not trying to convert anyone to any religion. I just wanted some people to read it on the off chance that they might find some wisdom in it and incorporate it into whatever knowledge they have thus far. my main point was that faith based religion can be uplifting emotionally but in terms of spiritual practice and evolution of consciousness it is counter productive because it relies on the experience of others rather than yourself.

Ummmm… yea thats what Im trying to say. I agree one hundred percent with both quotes posted above. Thats pretty much the basis of my argument.

Jesus can tell you that a spoon is hot, but until you touch that spoon for yourself you cannot verify whether it is hot or cold.

potentially the spoon could be cold! then wouldn’t you feel silly all that time thinking the spoon was hot when infact it was the opposite. the problem is that most Christians don’t believe they can touch that spoon themselves. which makes me very sad.

I have a question for amused himself to death.

I don’t think you would disagree with me if I said that Jesus knew the True Nature of Reality, and if you do disagree then please correct me. But my question is this.

Do you believe that you have the ability to see the true nature of reality?

yeahuh… the difference being that George Bush controls the direction of this country. implying that if George Bush is guiding the country and if George Bush is being guided by God, Then God infact is Guiding the country.

Implying that if another Person was elected who was not a Christian then the country would cease to be guided by god and would infact be against gods will.

implying that George Bush being President is in compliance with the will of God…

even though he’s a mass murderer

Why is it that you can’t be morally outraged about the Darfur crisis? Why can’t you attack that? 400,000 people have died in Africa, and all anybody ever does is attack George W. Bush. How about standing up for a cause that isn’t widely agreed upon, like, for instance, how the Sudanese government is committing genocide? Or is it that you are too afraid to be out alone, making a comment that could appear to be different from the mass, different from the norm?

Please, contribute something different, something worthwhile, and I will contribute something worthwhile back. Until then.

I am against the Darfur crisis and am Morally outraged by it!

make a comment different from the mass? I believe you said my comments were offensive to billions of people.

billions of people seem like a pretty good sized mass to differ from.

And as for George bush I only brought him up because it related to my argument that rulers use Christianity to control masses of people, and have done so since Emperor Constantine. which has lead to the complete deformity of the authentic teachings of Jesus.

I am certainly sad that Mass genocide is still committed on this planet, but I’m pretty sure there isn’t a big debate about whether or not Sudanese should be massacred. I think its pretty widely agreed that genocide is…um not good.

and if you want to talk numbers over 600,000 thousand people have been killed in Iraq tens of thousands being civilians.
is the Iraq war not cool enough for you anymore? yea I can understand that , mass murder makes me yawn after a few years too. I hope theres some more genocide in Africa so i can have different innocent deaths to be morally ouraged by.
chocolate ice cream gets played out fast when its the only flavor in the fridge.

a cause that isn’t widely agreed upon…hmmmm hmmmmmmmmmm a cause that isn’t widely agreed upon…hmmmmmm OH what about Esoteric Christianity. thats something that goes against what billions of people believe in.

Oh wait thats what this thread was about.

jesus christ I think I’m about to be amused to death!

Oh and you never answered my question.

jughand if you aren’t trying to convert people … then the main aim of this topic seems to be to attack people who’s spirituality is based in a different system to yours.

off topic … please check your pms

If no one attempts to speak out against the status quo we have tyranny of the majority. This principle alone is why America is a “free country” only so long as censorship of free speech is illegal.

The important thing is that the discussions remain civil without resulting in either side holding back their honest opinions, but without resorting to child like bickering.

If someone sees a legitimate problem with a religion, or with a nation, and they can’t express it becuase that would qualify as “converting” or “attacking” someone else’s personal views, then what?

I myself am personally interested in separating truth from lie and learning more about what Jesus actually taught, vs how authorities have shaped his teachings into compilations that may have suited their own agendas over the few thousand years we’ve seen.

Jesus is one of the most influential men in the mind’s of european/white people so i think some discussion about this could be good.

Oh brother. Do you honestly think that the Iraqi civilians are robots, and that simply because American troops are there, they are blowing the hell out of each other? No, I believe that each person in Iraq, whether they be Shia or Sunni, has the choice of free will, and can subsequently choose whether to murder or not. The 655,000 includes people who die because of the increased lawlessness and lack of health care. There are underlying tensions between the Shia and Sunni, and these deaths would have occured in any case, as Saddam would have died eventually. Without his coldhearted, tyrannical rule, Iraq will not last.

The Iraq War has never been right and I have never agreed with it. I was simply highlighting the oft ignored point that all anybody ever talks about is Iraq, which was actually supposed to create something positive, something that admittedly has failed miserably, whereas the Sudanese governement is intentionally killing a group of people and hardly anyone ever mentions that. The disparity is rather interesting, in my opinion. Does Africa not matter? Really, I find it hard to come to any other conclusion, considering that it rarely recieves any news time, or any mention at all in places like this.

And as for the bit about saying something different from the mass…I meant in regards to it being of relevance to anything.