First True Definition of OOBE

Up to date we have a clear definition for what is Lucid Dream and from there everything start. After that we have a definition for every major method known to man.
-We know what MILD stand for!
-We know what DILD stand for!
-We know what VILD stand for!
-We know what DEILD stand for!
-And finally we know what WILD stand for!
There is one thing that connect them all - they are all dreams!

Many thinks that OOBE and WILD are the same thing, but they are all wrong!
I have many unconscious OOBE, which I have no idea how I did, just a snippet of memory of before gone to sleep.
After my first OOBE at purpose, I can make the first clear definition of what OOBE is!

To WILD one must fall asleep consciously, a clear transition to dream world, therefore a dream!
OOBE and WILD are very similar, but with one clear difference that I will define. To have an OOBE one must not fall asleep, but to discard his physical body. To do this, one must let only his body fall asleep, but not his mind, it is similar to WILD, but the desired goal is different. So we can call the WILD desire is opposite of OOBE or that WILD is a Fake OOBE!

Some of the greatest discoveries came to be by mistake, in my case I fail at WILD. I couldn’t calm my mind to drift to sleep, in my anger I vigorously started to think what I must do for the day, but in the process, I incidentally discarded my body. Suddenly I got very wild spinning, that could ended my experience, but due to fast thinking I remembered about “roll out of body” technique and came out of my body successfully.

I thought to create tutorials on this, but on second thought I think they will come by themself.

p.s. You can sticky this.

I like that you’re trying to put a clearer distinction between different phenomenon that can be seem very similar.

I have noticed a few differences in opinion about how an OBE should be defined and I believe a lot of it stems from skepticism of whether or not it is truly possible to separate the consciousness from the body. Personally, I have also defined at “by the letter”, that is to say an “Out of Body Experience” is one in which you experience your consciousness being outside of your body. The keyword in that is of course experience. You can experience a sensation or circumstance through a simulation (think VR or even just really immersive movies/games/books). Especially with VR, you can experience flying a spaceship, with all the thrill and vertigo, but that doesn’t mean you have truly flown a spaceship. As we invent better technology to simulate the various acceleration forces you would feel on your body, our experience of flying a spaceship will become more accurate and less distinguishable from truly flying one. Taking it a step further, we currently do have one place where we can potentially simulate anything perfectly (given a strong enough imagination and will power): the dream realm.
So, my point with this rambling analogy is that dreams can allow us to experience any thing we wish,including being a consciousness outside of our body. Would this not be a case where you experience your consciousness being outside of your body, or an OBE for short?

That’s my reasoning. An OBE would describe a dream, induced in any manner (including WILD), about being outside your body, and it would also describe being in the waking reality separate from your body. For distinction, the latter is usually called astral projection, though some would argue there is a difference between the physical plane and astral plane. Some people go on to say that it is possible to be separate from your body on the astral plane (aka astral projection, again) OR on the physical plane, which would have to be called something else for clarity.

Of course, this all describes the phenomenon, not a methodology to achieve it. For that we would need a…hmm… WIOBE - ‘Wake Induced Out of Body Experience’?

tldr; I personally define OBE that it describes both AP (whether on the astral plane or physical plane) and (the subset of) dreams about being outside of your body.

Less related: I prefer OBE over OOBE. I just think it’s a more aesthetically pleasing acronym. :tongue:

i remember reading some paper, but i forget where, about trying to understand exactly this distinction.

as i recall, OBEs tend to have these features which differentiate them from a standard WILD experience:

  1. the self does not exist in a dream body, but is a point or orb of perspective
  2. things appear exactly like in real life
  3. there is no dream control or interaction, people dont see you, you can only observe.

for contrast, in my WILDs sometimes the room appears different (night instead of day, other characters or objects, or just the room is different), i have a dream body, and i have as much dream control as i reach for. the start may be different, but once im in the dream it behaves like any lucid dream.

i dont know whether this makes OBEs a restricted subset of WILD or a separate phenomenon from WILD, but many people report experiences that have those specific three features which are so different from anything ive ever experienced with a lucid dream. this suggests there may be a truly separate phenomenon. OBEs also are often reported by people who are not habitual lucid dreamers but who are in one or another extreme circumstance, or who are trying to create an OBE, rather than under normal sleep conditions.

i personally believe OBEs are different from what id call WILD, though i have no knowledge or opinion on whether this other phenomenon is another kind of dream or some actual projection of consciousness in space. id love to see more research on it!

As one who does both… I can say OBEs and WILDs are certainly different things. There is much confusion though out there about this as many who have never experienced a true OBE have “lucid dreamed” they are having an OBE so believe they did. You can lucid dream anything you think about.

Another thing which has lead to confusion is that it is possible to be experiencing both some true astral projection and some lucid dreaming at the same time… just like how you can be experiencing your physical body and start “daydreaming”. You can do both so at times if the person is not fully awake when doing their OBE, there can be a bit of cross over happening.

People seem to either be more natural at having LDs or may natural at having OBEs. The states are so very similar and people tend to get into the habit of doing one or the other. Hence I only focus on one of those things and take long breaks before changing my focus.

I for a long time found LD far more fun… when you enter a LD there is like a story line to the whole thing you can play about with. When when is astral (OBE)… well it can be a lot more boring as rarely there will be others about and you cant be irresponsible if OBE and mess with real beings (well you could do but it would be a very stupid thing to be doing). You can easily end up in real trouble if you don’t act responsibly when other beings are about if you are having a OBE eg I was having an OBE and thought I’d go and visit a teacher I had at the time without asking permission first.

Turned out he had astral traps about his place so that lead to me having a hellish experience where I actually found myself caught in one of his traps. It was hurting and I was screaming my head off and couldn’t get back to my body till I ended up convincing it to release me by making it clear I meant no harm and I didn’t mean to do the wrong thing.

Another time I messed about things I should not have while astral… and it turned out what I was messing around with was actually guarded and the being then unaware to me till it was too late, followed me back to my physical body. I nearly was actually killed.

I was physically blue as that demon affected my ability to breath by blowing a thick energy in my face and I couldn’t get air through it. If another being hadn’t come to my aid when I was astally screaming and calling for help, I would be dead. When another pulled it off of me allowing me to get up and I was able to then stagger out of bed and was such guastly colours in my face as I really could not breath while that being had me and did what it did (my lips were actually blue from not being able to breath). You do not have to worry about anything like this stuff if you are only LD as it’s in your mind… it’s your subconsciousness creating the dream (along with your own lucidity).

After working on LDing for years… my interest has gone back to OBEs as I have had several experiences during OBEs where I’ve actually interacted with our physical world… found out about things I previously didnt know through seeing while OBE etc.

Ive had at least 3 experiences where I’ve interacted with the physical during an OBE (one time a physical chair moved, witnessed by others who were physical at the time. I’d been astrally trying to OBE to where that chair unknown to me had been placed and it was in the way).

So the differences for me are… OBE… there is no story line, you have to think more about what you do as things will not be usually just be happening about you. OBE the ability to interact with and see the real physical plane (Ive heard of OBE people pinching another who is physical and leaving bruises, I have not tried that one).

I find myself far more restricted than in a LD eg for me I seem to be very energy dense when OBE, I find it hard to walk throu walls, they give a bit to me but it’s near impossible for myself to push through them due to how dense I am (I seems to be projecting out to a level very close to our physical one). I can trust what I see is real or really there and not a dream during an OBE eg if I go and look around my house there is nothing I see not really there.

One time when I was inspecting my house when OBE… I saw something weird. That was it looked like someone had a party in my lounge room, there should not have been wrapping paper, paper cups etc strewn all over the room. As I knew it was an OBE and not a LD I set out to work out “why???” as I knew there must be a reason for what I was seeing

When I asked my daughter what she dreamed it turned out she had just dreamed that she had a birthday party in that room. So what I saw was there due to her thoughts “temporary” affecting the astral or maybe she even had the party there while she was astral herself hence leaving astral copies of what she was doing. Anyway… if you are OBE things should be how they are in the physical (like a copy of the physical) but with occassional differences if someone has affected things.