Lucid NON-Dreaming

I hope this is the right thing. Anyway, here’s something I recently thought of, after I drank some glasses of wine at a party and expected some kind of strange effect, not having ever been drunk or ever near it(didn’t work, by the way, but perhaps it’s better like this). For some of the skilled LDers here, does their ability to remain lucid while dreaming also affect positively their ability to remain concsious when in other situations where their judgements/mental processes are supposed to be clouded or not working, like when drugged/drunk or in similar conditions? Just a question that I thought could have been interesting for others, too. If yes, that would be a really useful side-effect.

I guess you could pull yourself from a drunk/drug, but I don’t think it correlates to your lucid dreaming abilities. And also it mightt fall along your resistance to whats entering your body or your willpower. Like for me, all chemicals are easily overpowered by willpower, but I still have to learn techniques and practice everynight for lucid dreaming. :smile:

Hope that answered your question.

Crystalomancy, or crystalgazing, sometimes involves visions in the ball brought on by drugs, alcohol, or otherwise dulled senses. Other odd occult crap involves herbal use.

Scientifically, though, crystalomancy is best practiced as if you were practicing WBTB. This, of course, without use of drugs. So, if this applies, to crystalgazing, it would very likely apply to dreaming as well.

Besides all of this, lucid dreaming requires something stated in it’s name: lucidity! You can’t have senses dulled by drug. You can’t be completely awake, but you can’t be asleep either. Conditions have to be near perfect, and drugs would have the opposite effect.

From my experience, the ability to remain lucid while dreaming doesn’t apply to states which are induced by alcohol, etc. Another lucid dreamer I know, who is very good at it and practices meditation, tried once to drink and she just got drunk.

Now, I’ll explain why.

First of all, the term “lucidity” is misleading. When you’re drunk, staying lucid mean you can continue to think and act almost efficiently. The term “lucidity” refering to LD’ing means you realize it’s a dream. Thus it’s not the same “lucidity” at all.

Now LD’ing means you’re dreaming. It’s not the case with drugs. For instance, if you are under the effect of an hallucinogenic and you suppose that the big truck you see is a dream, it may be annoying. From what I’ve heard, it is difficult to distinguish between reality and hallucination, particularly if this hallucination reproduces something common. Hence the meaning of “lucidity” which is used in dreams can’t apply here.

Finally, drugs modify your brain chemistry and I don’t think you can change this physical effect by just you willing it. But I don’t think it’s really the question cause comparing dreams and various effects of various substances or what is called “lucidity” in waking life and dream “lucidity” are both false problems in my opinion.

Important note: as it’s told in the Forum Guidelines, drugs discussions are not allowed on the forum. So if you want to discuss this, please let it very general. Please don’t speak about a precise drug by name or describe too precisely your experiences. Comments like “drugs are good/bad” will be deleted too. If I have to remove too much comments, this topic will be locked or deleted.

senses dulled is not really a proper description for drug use.
senses amplified and distorted and changed, yeah… dulled? depends. in many cases they are greatly sensitized beyond our normal allowances.

drugs come in many different flavors, and do many different things. some heighten sensory awareness, and if we can talk about legal ones, caffeine would be an example.

some heighten specifically touch and make you extremely and overabundantly aware of the aspect of touch.

some make the mind hazy and confused. some make the mind sharp, lucid, clean.

some make it very introspective, where thought associations with the right/subconscious brain are easy such as dog paw cat hat bat sat mat flat drape… for great enhancement of imagination.

some produce a dullness of the tactile organs and promote a sleepy dreamy hazy “dopey” feeling.

alcohol itself dulls tactile sensation, messes with coordination, and removes inhibition from the personality. it produces some feelings of pleasure/euphoria but has toxic effects upon the body.

really lucid dreaming has nothing to do with getting a hold of yourself under the influence of drugs. for some drugs it is pretty dangerous to try to control the experience, as it can only lead to freaking out, and generally speaking if you take something other than a threshold dose for heightened awareness, such as a cup of coffee or 1 beer for some relaxation… isn’t the point of taking drugs to lose control completely?

lucidity has so many factors, some people are lucid because they pay good attention to their surroundings and can tell when something illogical happens. some are just good at remaining a prevalent sense of awareness, such as through meditation, so that they just naturally notice when the dream state starts.

some do it just by intending to.

but regardless, yes the brain does use chemicals to give you dreams, but it’s far different than putting a large amount of chemicals into your body. you can wake up from a dream pretty easy by fighting it… you can’t wake up from a psychedelic trip until the chemicals are out of your body.

it’s not a good idea to try either. if you take something, you have to make a very informed decision, and if you find yourself in over your head you can’t really do much but breathe and try and find enjoyment, seek out help from friends or family, or medical attention if you took something physically dangerous.

so if you want a lucid head, and you want to drink wine… you drink just a few glasses… or one glass. if you intend to get drunk, and expect lucid clarity, you will probably push yourself over the edge.

the last time i drank i had this problem. “oh i’m so drunk, but i still feel super conscious and connected to everything… better chug a ton more…” it didn’t end well. :sad:

curiously though i did feel very “present” and “clear” despite my drunkeness until i crossed the threshold, it’s possible how your brain is might have something to do with it. i do not drink often and have sworn off drunkeness, as alcohol is one of the most dangerous drugs on the planet unless used responsibly.

You need to drink more :wink:

It would be cool but I don’t think skilled LDers can negate the effect of drink/drugs. Maybe if they were ultra-amazing LDers, I don’t know to be honest. I think it’s more down to personality actually, some people can act sober to get past bouncers, others can’t, I suppose that’s different though. :shrug:

I have found that when I am drinking I can focus like I do while dreaming I become sober for as long as I keep focused.