Rapid Eye Movement, Sleep Paralysis, my LD'ing attempts

Quest for Lucidity
1

Hello!

I registered to ask a few questions(And also maybe make me dream about this tonight and make me realize I’m in a dream!)

I’d like to say in advance that this message turned out quite long. Sorry about that!

A few short notes on what I’ve been doing so far:

  • Write down dreams I remember. At first it was just a line of writing, but one of my latest dreams took up 1/4 of a page(Bigger than A4 size, possibly A3)
  • Reading on these forums before going to bed
  • Reading dream journal before going to sleep
  • Asking myself during the day “Is this a dream?”
  • Generally thinking about LDs during the day

Been experimenting with LD’ing for a week or two now I guess.

First thing I’d like to ask about is an experience which I believe is the closest I’ve been to an LD. This was the first time I really tried to get an LD so I didn’t have too much info, but I’ve been reading a bit on the site since then and saw someone mention that Rapid Eye Movement will happen during the REM stage? Correct?

Well, during my first attempt I just laid on my back and laid still and was very stubborn and decided to not move and just concentrate on dreaming. After maybe 30 minutes(Though I imagine the sense of time can be confused in a situation like this) my body started to feel a little more relaxed than usual. Then it gradually increased to the point where it felt like my body wasn’t there at all. I just kept lying there and after a while my eyes started freaking out and moving very fast.

My reaction was that it was annoying and interrupting my concentration. After a while I just opened my eyes to stop it and it stopped. Then I went back to sleep and had no LD.
I also see the colored ‘dots’ that sometimes briefly form images, but I sometimes feel like I’m just looking at my eyelids… Maybe if I’m trying too hard, this might happen?

I have had other experiences where I feel like I might be getting close.
For example, if I try to lightly move my arm without actually moving it while being in this ‘can’t-really-feel-my-body’ state, it kinda feels like I am actually moving…It’s a little hard to explain, but I suspect this is a good sign and probably others have experienced.

I have however not yet noticed(Not saying it didn’t happen, but I haven’t noticed any of it) any sounds or feelings of vibration.

Now on to my second inquiry.
Sleep Paralysis.
Now, I’ve read and heard about this and it sounds quite frightening… and by ‘quite’ I mean absolutley horrifying. It sounds like something that will draw out my fears and shove them in my face. Considering some of the stuff that lurks around in my mind during the day, I can imagine a SP hallucination would be… Well, horrible. I have not yet decided wheter or not I actually want to experience this, so for now I want to avoid it.
I’ve seen people write stuff like “demons/Ghosts/whatever isn’t real and just tell yourself that it’s not real”
However, the way I think about the world we live in, that’s not quite good enough.
I’ll just ask a few questions:

  • Is it possible to close your eyes after opening them during SP?
  • Will sleeping on my side, facing the wall decrease the potential of hallucinations?
    Seeing as a whole room probably has more potential for weird stuff moving around than a blank wall.
    Though I have only achieved a feeling of being close to an LD while sleeping on my back… Any advice on this subject?

I guess my questions might be a little vague, but I’m also after some comments on my experiences from people who have more experience.
I hope I didn’t forget to write anything. Oh well, going to bed now!

2

I have been interested on sleep positions and LD.
I can WILD to a state of partial SP then i just have normal dreams,
ONLY when i sleep on my back. Everytime I sleep on my side, fetal posisition stylez, i get no dreams and wake up sore back.

so ya, Sleeping on your back is more conductive to LD, from my expierience

3

Hey, thank you for the reply!

Hm, I’ve pretty much always slept on my side in my whole life. I guess I’ll stick to lying on my back for now.

4

Hello, DassetWhoopah,

First of - take it easy, you 're doing great! Remembering and recording dreams is the first stage of becoming lucid. It is not simple from the beginning since our minds are designed to “reset” dream recall after each dream. Don’t get discouraged if you don’t remember a thing - just make a comment in your DJ and leave it be. Maybe an event or a person or a conversation or something during the day will trigger the recollection of dreams. If not, there 's always tomorrow.

Now, to your questions. You are correct - Rapid Eye Movement is main property of REM phase (thus the name). What you described as your first attempt is called WILD - Wake Induced Lucid Dream. According to my experiences this is the most difficult technique - it requires complete stillness of the body while the mind remains active/awake. And whenever you move, you have to start all over again… Fast movement of the eyes that you describe is final stage of WILD - if you didn’t open your eyes to stop it, you could have awaken within a dream…

Regarding the colored “dots” - those are HI (Hypnagogic Images). They appear before your inner screen every time you close your eyes, so it has nothing to do with your trying too hard. Do try - close your eyes, relax and pay attention to lighter and darker shades that start to appear before you. It is a bit difficult at first but it gets easier with practice.

Sleep Paralysis is also a completely natural state - it is body’s security mechanism that prevents us from acting out our dreams and in doing so hurting ourselves in the process. It is the final stage of WILD - after SP kicks in, the pulsating (feelings of vibration) starts and off you go. It happens to everybody and it happens more than once per night. The thing is that people are not aware of it and that’s why it is so unpleasant if you wake up during SP - the feeling of “dead weight”, not being able to move and talk,… There are tricks to get yourself out of it - you can try to move a finger or to touch the sky in your mouth with your tongue. The point is to redirect your attention to some other activity then SP, which gives your body time to wake up normally. In my experience the worst hallucinations don’t come from SP but rather from FA.

Of course. The problem is that by opening your eyes during SP you stop the experience and you have to start over if you want to try it again.

As far as I can tell the body position doesn’t influence hallucinations, so I think the answer is NO, that will not decrease the potential of hallucinations. Besides, a white wall can be a handful if you start to concentrate on it. However, body position does effect dreaming itself - as far as I can say lying on my back increases probability of consciously entering a dream. But on the other hand, it also increases probability of SP and FA.

I hope this helps.

Best of luck in your quest for LD.

Regards,

5

Hey!
Thanks for your reply!

"if you didn’t open your eyes to stop it, you could have awaken within a dream… "

I was suspicious that this was the case, haha! However, at the time I just found it annoying and distracting, but I’ll be sure to not open them next time!

I think I’m going to try to do what I did the first time, or WILD as it’s called. I can be quite stubborn so I should be able to resist any urges to move. I could also try to keep track of how relaxed my body feels to keep something ‘interesting’ going on in my mind to prevent it from wandering.

I guess you might be right about the wall… For all I know, the wall could grow a face during the hallucinations, haha! I think I would prefer that to seeing something in my room though, since my room is something I can relate to. A wall is such a general thing… But I’ll be sleeping on my back since it seems te be the most effective.

I’ll also experiment with moving my ‘dream body’ slightly when my body is in that ultra relaxed state, and will not actually move if I try to do slight movements.
I haven’t tried doing big movements in this state to check if I actually am paralyzed since that could ruin my chance of an LD.

I’ll read a bit more about False Awakenings, thanks.
(That reminds me of those times I dreamed getting out of bed, going to the bus, going to school and then waking up realizing I haven’t done any of those things, haha!)

6

This state can be awesome. :tongue: I think you should try to imagine your body moving, instead of trying to move it slightly. It may seem like the same thing… In this state, if you’re lucky, imagining moving your body will feel really vivid and this is a great way to “detach” your dream body from your physical body. It’s as if in this state, muscles will try to move the physical body, but imagination will try to move the dream body.

The idea is to forget about your real body, creating a dream body and putting your focus on it, it’s movements and what it feels is a good way to enter a dream actively. You can try reaching out and touching a wall, feeling it’s texture. It doesn’t even have to be the wall by your bed. You can imagine you’re outside touching another wall.

7

Hey! Thanks for the tips, I’ll give it a whirl!