Sexual energy and lucid dreaming

How important is sexual energy for lucid dreaming?. A waste of sexual energy could cause a lack in dream recalling? Is lucid dreaming impowered or reduced with celibate? What is the role of sexual energy and desire in the building of dreams? I dont know if there is already a tread for this…

This is what I think and what I think If learned:

In order to be lucid in a dream we need to have presence, wich means not identifying with the contents of the dream. We step aside from our own dream in order to reconize the truth. We need to distinguish between fantasies and us, we need to contemplate our instincts and fantasys like a witness, not being involved with them in the dream, altough still being in it. And to do this, we need energy.

We need sexual energy to dream, but also to be consciuos while doing it. Actually, dreams are our dispersed energy creating objects and situations, wich means that if we could concentrate all our energy in ourselfs, we wouldnt dream at all. ¡Samadhi! we would attain. Real lucidity, at least for yoguis, happens only when we stop dreaming and experience pure consciousness without its tipical framentation.

When we use all our energy on fantasys we have unconsciuos dreaming, our mind is out of control, wondering, pretending to fullfil desires and repeating past conflicts. Lucid dreams happen when we save some energy for ourselfs, but still give a lot to a fictional scenario. Samadhi, or inner liberation ocurrs when we calm and concentrate all our energy, we retire all our atention from objetcs, so we dont give life to them. (dream)

We shall not confuse celibate with sexual represion, this false intepretation will cause only more unconsiuos fantasys during the night. We need to USE the energy we save, Invest it in something wich makes us real happy, not just pupets of our own desires. Detachment is the key for lucid living and dreaming, meditation and retainment the only way I know.

We need to stay focused to lucid dream, and that strenght comes from sexual enery converted into consciouness.

I dont want to argue but i got to say i disagree with most above.
First of all i dont think we need energy to dream or to be lucid.If we do i dont see why would that be sexuall energy involved in it.Dreams are creations of our thoughts and only person who dont have thoughts would not dream(not counting all brain damages).
Secondly,even if i dont think this energy has to be saved in any way.Guess sleeping itself restores our enrgies and rebuids what needs to be rebuild.
Thirdly- on my own example id say something quite otherwise- most lucids i got on the nights when im sexually exhausted.Totally.
And fourthly(?) - being a puppet of my own desires is something that makes me really happy.Im very happy being given them and have posibilities to live them out.
Again,please dont take it as trying to argue,just personal point of view.
take care

Interesting argument. If you are really happy, please keep that way of thinking. :wink:

well you dont need sexual energy but you certainly need determination and the intention to remember, like in MILD, you have to have the focus and determination to remember and really WANT to have the dream

but the OP may be right now that i think about it

one summer i was at camp and for that reason i could not masturbate because we all slept in public rooms. So i guess i built up a lot of ‘sexual energy’ and it may be a coincidence, but that summer was one of my most lucid-dream filled summers ever

agreeing with jack on this one. i practice sexual energy cultivation which basically amounts to orgasming w/o ejaculating, anyway, i find when i do ejaculate i will have either a lucid or a particularly vivid dream

Sexual desire wont let us become lucid. Lack of it give us tranquility to see things more objectivly. The reason for having LD after orgasm is because it helps on relaxation of the mind and body. In oder words, its not sex wich produce lucid dreams, but lack of it, lack of sexual activity and tension. See, sex is not the cause for LD, its that tranquil state after sex wich can naturally cause it.

Desire drives us crazy, while experiencing it we are not happy, exitment is suffer, lack of it its real happinnes and peleasure. So when we have sex we are not trying to be exited but to achieve some peace. Sex makes us unhappy, its when we end doing it that we feel relaxed. At least thats the occidental type of sex.

I, ve too had lucids after sex, but cant credit sex for that. Pleasure to me is lack of sex, lack of need. There is no pleasure in desire, becuase desire means we are looking for something we still dont have. Desire puts us away from the object, and thats painful.

Celibate is not retention of desire. Its complete ausence of it. Being in peace is very similar as being death. Meditation for example is a way of reducing almost all mental and biological functions to experience these “vegetative” state of being.

So desire is life, lack of it death. From this point of view, when we have sex we are not trying to feel alive, but to die. To kill desire. When we realize we are dreaming, just the moment when we awake, is like stoping the wheel of desire, we dont follow the movement of dream, we kill or reduce speed of the dream, we stop feeding it for a moment. We practice celibate, we do self retainment. Our unconciuos stops having too much power on us.

1.“Sex makes us unhappy, its when we end doing it that we feel relaxed”

2."Desire drives us crazy, while experiencing it we are not happy, exitment is suffer, lack of it its real happinnes and peleasure"

  3."From this point of view, when we have sex we are not trying to feel alive, but to die. To kill desire."

Us?I dont see how sex makes anyone unhappy- actually sometimes when we end it we feel unhappy for various reasons.And i see more ppl unhappy cuz of lack of it and many frustrations connected with than unhappy of having it.But i guess it depends on your view about sexuall activities.

Sex is one of the biggest pleasures given to mankind.Sex itself,not orgasms as you put it.For many just doing it is a virtue.How it ends is second in importance- its what we feel ,what we see,what we hear,what we admire…DURING.I personally could compare it to watching sunsets ,wonders of nature, or masterpieces of art.Seeing how much one can give to another,seeing her or his body thrilled by your touch,your whispers and your caressing is leaving one speechless.Seeing this union of two bodies and minds is a miracle itself.

Desire drives us crazy?Again i dont know whos us but even if this crazyness isnt anything painfull.Life without excitment ,without expecting it would be plain and boring.

And finally i dont think im killing any desire.....its more of putting my excitment and will to feel united with someone into act.It sure kills desire for a moment but i dont think i did it more than few times just for purpose of killing desire.And even in those situations act itself was great.

the less sex I have, the less sexual dreams :confused:

IMHO there are lucid dreams and lucid dreams.
And if you want to reach a certain “beyond” you may need every single bit of energy.

Some people would say that it’s the ego who wastes the most of our energy with his folly/stupidity. Sexuality can be seen, in an ultimate way, just another ego projection.

But, hey, who am I to talk about things like these ? :eek:

As I said, if it makes you really happy, please keep living and thinking like that.

The way I see sex is only my “personal” perspective. I believe giving ourselfes to life is a mistake. I speak in plural because I think our human condition is the same for almost everyone. To me sex is a failed intent of achiving something, and I can hardly believe some can enyoy it just for the act itself. “We are predators” not inocent joyfull beings. Sex can be a way of sharing plentyness(like meditative sex), but trouble comes when we look at it as a way of being complete, “united” as you said. If we become atached we lose freedom, and theres is no love if you are a slave. Sex without semen retention and sacred motive is just a predator/egotic activity.

There are always people who know life is a dream, and they say “ok, lets experience the dream, let dream it cool”, but there are others who say: “Life is a dream, and I want to wake up”. You remember me one of my DC, he was an existencialist, with a coat and a cigarrete in a lonely road. He told me. "Yes, I know this is a dream but I like to be inside this matrix, it doesnt matter to me if its real or not. Then he smoked a bit of its cigar and said ¡Ah, sweet!. He then walked away saying, “not everyone is ready to accept the truth, some prefere to fool around with themselves a little bit more”.

If it makes you feel good why should someone stop doing it?, well, I thinks its because sooner or later we find that our activitys were only a defense mechanism to avoid pain, pain of being a spirit trapped in a mortal body and in a prison for mind. As you said, one become unhappy when sex is over, and then we need more anesthesia, a temporal cure.

Life is a dream, but to me is a horrible dream with a posibility of liberation, it doesnt matter the good things it has, if they dont last for ever, they dont have any real value. (for me of course). You admire life, you are in love with it, fine I respect that and I think I understand why.

It would be useless me trying to convince anyone, we are all atached enough to our conceptions of life to let something “new” in.

So what if someone wanted to lucid dream, so that they could go to a celebrities house and have sexual intercourse with that celebrity? Would it not work?

By the way…this is something I just thought of now. Its not something I was looking forward to. I want to fly beyond the universe.

Well thought post Onironauta - i like the way you clarify things.But…heh…o well…but i honestly cant see it the way you put it and the way you feel it.In my opinion such views are just not good for the person himself.I mean…doh…i find it hard to believe how one can think this way and not be frustrated and not feel sorry how much one misses soooo much.
Its not that i dont agree(that obviously too) but it makes me kinda sad that this part of life,so great and fulfilling can be not experienced by someone…or experienced the way you describe it.
I think we stay on the opposite sides of the scale and its best if we just stay there,but im so much tempted to drag you on my side:)
take care:)

This thread reminded me of something from chinese cultural art, a famous piece called, “The Vinegar Tasters.”

The picture consists of three men standing around a pot and each tasting it’s contents. The first man has a sour expression on his face, the second man has a bitter expression, but the the third man is smiling.

Of course the picture is a metaphor. The pot of vinegar represents life. The first man represents Confucious, who thought life on earth was out harmony with “the Way” of heaven and therefore a sour state of affairs.

The second man represents Buddha, who taught that life is bitter, filled attatchments and desires that ultimately always lead to suffering.

The third man represents Lao Tze, the (some say mythical) founder of Taoism. He is smiling because in his view, the world is neither a horrible nightmarish illusion, nor the chaotic result of man’s “fall from grace,” but simply a lesson to be learned, a rhythm to be felt, a current to followed, etc…

Can anyone guess which is my favorite? :wink:

I wanted to jump in here because I think I can offer a fairly unique persepctive to the discussion. For over five years, I’ve practiced a relatively new technique for male multiple orgasm that is not based on semen retention, but nonetheless enables me to enjoy orgasms as much as I wish without any urge to ejaculate even for days or weeks at a time.

To me, classical semen retention techniques such as Tantra and Taoist Sexual Chi Gung are like the Confucianists, struggling against natural impulse to make things “the way they should be.”

To me, the western technique I learned is much more “natural” in the sense that it teaches men how to fully enjoy their orgasmic potential without having to fight their own bodies in the process. The result is the opportunity to truly be present and orgasmically free with one’s self or one’s partner without having to “think about baseball,” or try to “hold back,” etc. And the length of an encounter no longer hinges on “how long you can hold on,” but rather how much pleasure you both can take.

A sexual encounter can end with both partners fulfilled, rather than dwelling on “what could have been.” Most importantly, the other men I know who have learned this successfully, all say the same thing, ejaculation is totally optional. With this technique, deciding whether to finish an encounter with or without ejaculation is literally as easy as flipping a light switch.

So, regarding sexual desire and fulfillment, I just felt obligated to mention that, like the third man in the painting, I’m usually smiling at every step of the way, whether it’s the anticipation of joining with my wife, the joy of expressing our love and ecstasy, or the lingering afterglow that comes from being together in a way that is so totally open. In my experience (and I know many practitioners of Tantra or similiar techniques would agree) when a couple achieve’s an ecstatic union (or an ecstatic connection with one’s self) feelings of desire, arousal, and pleasure can linger for hours or even days afterward, whether it included ejaculation or not.

So I understand (and used to agree with) Oniranauta’s idea of sex, and ejaculation in particular, being associated with “death.” But I’ve gotta say, my recent experiences have taught me that sex, like dreams and like life, is ultimately what you make of it.

One can say desire only serves to enhace the feeling of separation bewteen one’s self and one’s goal. On the other hand, I’ve often found the old saying, “absence makes the heart grow fonder,” to be not only true but also comforting. So, in keeping with Taoist ideal of balance, I think a little desire mixed with a little satisfation is a wonderful way to go through life. But that’s just me. :tongue:

And as for sexual energy and it’s effect on dreams (yes, I actually remembered it’s about dreams, lol) personally I’ve gone lucid a couple hours after ejaculating and when I haven’t done so for over 2 weeks, so I have no idea which is more productive. All I know is traditionally, most cultures see sexual energy as closely connected with mental energy. Some say great leaders usually have strong libidos for this same reason.

Which could lead to an interesting side discussion about Bill Clinton… :content:

im with jack completely but Onironauta has his point.

PanDragon can you post any info on this “technique” or a link to another site that has info on it.

And I also I think I agree more with Onironauta… lately.
(Ever since I started reading WAKE UP TO YOUR LIFE, wich is great)

Sure dd dd,

The technique is called, KSMO or Key Sound Multiple Orgasm. The website is www.multiples.com.

If you decide to try it take it from me, use the forum, ask questions, and attend some of live coaching chats. You’ll learn way faster that way, and it’s all free stuff that comes with the seminar anyway. Might as well take advantage. :wink:

Peace