Very good point. The connotations of nice, natural sounding names versus technical, scientific sounding names only clouds this kind of debate further. I think people in general are given to think that anything with the label ‘natural’ stuck to it is automatically better than something artificial…
“Water?”
“Why yes! Great stuff, this water!”
“Dihydrogen monoxide?”
“Huh? What kind of chemicals are you trying to make me drink, Mr Scientist??”
I’ll say a little more about the natural/artificial dichotomy in a bit…
It’s nice to meet you too Shakanah. And welcome to the forums by the way
Don’t worry, you won’t offend me with anything you say. And for my part I’m not out to offend anyone either. I’d just like to keep others (and myself as well) thinking. It can be helpful when you’re trying to come to the truth about anything to have a skeptic included in the discussion. And when it comes to something like this, where I think there is an amount of risk involved, it’s best to be certain that everyone is clear on all the information at hand so that they can make good decisions. I’m sure this is one thing you and I agree on.
I’m not sure myself whether sun gazing is as dangerous, or even if it’s the same sort of ‘dangerous’ as certain drugs, if you see what I mean. But I just thought I’d raise the point: we don’t allow discussion about drugs on the forums because if someone were to go and try them, and hurt themselves, then we might share some responsibility for that. I would just hate for someone to damage their vision because of something they read here as well, that’s all I’m getting at. In any case, I’m glad we agree that whatever someone does, it should be done safely.
As it happens, I know a little bit about the sun. I wouldn’t have made the claims in this thread that I have if I did not have some evidence to back them up, after all. In fact I’ve always been an astronomy geek. I loved to learn about stars and planets, even when I was a child. I’ve even had the chance to study a little bit about astronomy in university, and I did pretty well in those classes. So, the sun being a star, I’d say I know at least enough about how stars work to hold my own in a topic like this. Of course I like to keep reading and learning more as well, and I realize that we still have a lot to learn. In fact, that’s what keeps me interested in science, the very fact that we know so little. Of course I’d be happy to read through some of the links you provided below anytime. But as for the reasons I’m skeptical about sun gazing, and about alternative medicine in general, I’ll say a little bit more about that below.
Believe me, I’m well aware of how dangerous prescription medications are. After all, that’s why doctors have to have a license to prescribe them, and pharmacists to dispense them. And that’s also why both of these kinds of professionals have to spend years educating themselves on the uses and effects of different medications. I think all of this makes it pretty obvious that, if used improperly (even doctors can make mistakes when prescribing medicine, after all, they’re only human) prescription medicine can be nasty. But when it comes to western medicine, I have a similar opinion to what Churchill said about democracy…that is, western medicine may be the worst form of medicine there is, except for all the other ones.
Now I don’t want to carry this thread too far off-topic, so if you like we could talk about alternative medicine in another thread. I’m sure we’d have a pretty stimulating discussion! For now, I’ll just say a little more and then get back on track. The fact is, western medicine works. There are some very sad cases that probably could have been helped by western medicine, but weren’t. I’m thinking of Andy Kaufmann, the performance artist, who was diagnosed with lung cancer. He used all kinds of alternative treatment to no avail. Western medicine might not have saved his life, as he did have a pretty aggressive kind of cancer…but it may have given him a fighting chance. Another example is Steve Jobs, who went for months without any treatment on his pancreatic cancer, opting for alternative treatments instead, which didn’t work. His life might have been saved had he chosen to intervene earlier with more conventional treatment. Finally, if western medicine were practised more, and better, in developing parts of the world, we could increase the average lifespan of these populations to a huge degree. The thing is these areas are where more traditional medicine is practised the most. I don’t think it’s a bad thing to use alternative medicine per se, as long as you are getting some kind of treatments that work…but opting for only alternative medicine when we have affective treatments available in western medicine can be awfully wasteful. Now I hope I don’t sound like accusing you of this, because it sounds like you’re taking a both/and approach to medicine…but I just think it would be a shame for anyone to pick something that has no medical value just because it’s “natural” or “alternative,” when we have treatments that we know work. Anyway, back to the topic…
I agree with you, that is, that the sun can be beneficial. But we still have to take precautions in light of damage to the ozone layer, etc. Heck, I think people should go outside more and get their helping of vitamin D as well! But needless to say this is much safer than staring straight into the sun. So by all means, spend some time outside…if you don’t want to wear sunscreen, spend your time in the shade or wear proper clothing on days with a high UV index (although I think people should still wear sunscreen). You’ll get no arguments from me on the benefits of going outside and being active, getting fresh air and sunshine and so on.
But on that note, isn’t sun gazing not only dangerous, but completely unnecessary? Why gaze directly at something that can blind you when you can simply spend a few hours outside? That’s another one of the odd things about sun gazing, to me at least…that there are less dangerous ways to get the same benefits that sun gazing advocates talk about. Why not do that instead of risking damage to your eyes? It just doesn’t make any sense to me.
I might be straying a little off-topic again. If so, I apologize…we could certainly talk about this more in a discussion about alternative medicine too. Anyhow, this is just a quick word about the sort of ‘naturalism’ that’s been brought up a few times now. It’s true that a lot of illnesses that are rampant now occurred much less frequently before we became so industrialized and so consumerist. The fact is, we buy and use a lot of things we don’t need to and which aren’t good for us. But it’s a trade-off, and I for one rather like having computers, electricity, and things like that. But those things aside, we have to be careful about how much power we attribute to ‘natural’ medicine or our natural immune system. After all many illnesses are also natural. My body has a natural capacity to heal injuries or to fight off certain diseases, but a lot of those diseases are natural too…viruses, bacteria, and so on. Just think about how certain diseases have been nearly wiped out thanks to vaccines. Or, how illnesses that were deadly just a few centuries ago can now be treated with simple antibiotics. My point is here is that we should try to avoid a ‘natural vs. technological’ sort of mindset when it comes to medicine, because this is a false dichotomy. Our modern world and the lifestyle that goes with it can be bad for us sometimes…but in a lot of cases, the medicine that goes with it is great! Same goes for natural things…getting out and getting some sun, like we’ve been talking about here, is fantastic…it’s perfectly natural. The hemlock that killed Socrates was also perfectly natural.
You seem like you’ve really given all this a great deal of thought, and that’s wonderful. When I rain on people’s parades I’m only doing so, so that they have something else to think about. I hope that whoever reads this thread takes what each of us has had to say into consideration, because I do think you’ve raised some good points. And of course, if you’re up for a chat about alternative medicine, maybe we can start another topic on it? In the meant time, stay well