I sent you an email requesting further information; a more comprehensive owner’s manual, operating instructions, a tutorial or even a schematic. You sent me nothing but asked me to call you. I called you numerous times and left messages but never received a callback. Previous to that, I sent many emails concerning the status of my DreamMaker order. Many went unanswered. I am not used to being treated like this as a paying customer. What was I supposed to do Bruce?
The biggest problem with the DreamMaker Basic is the lack of the “Dream Alarm”. There are four dual CMOS timers, that’s 8 - “555 timer” circuits. Use one for the Dream Alarm delay after REM detection and one for the Dream Alarm duration.
Bottom line - I just want to have lucid dreams. Apparently, this DreamMaker I received is not going to do the job. Now you can do what’s right and send me something that will do the job as advertised or we can continue the email tag.
If you were to reply with some constructive comments that would have been
different.
I’m more than willing to look at design changes even on units that have been
shipped already. I’m about being ProActive.
But you came at me in an attacking way - saying 100 more people are going to
be pissed and what is this and that!
OK - all the timers are used up. Several are just for the beep sequence.
Timers are used for the REM detection as well. For example there is a 2 sec astable timer constantly sending pulses to a 10 second monostable timer which prevents the 10 sec one from timing out. Once the 2 sec timer is interupted by a constant signal from the detector for at least 2 seconds it will allow the 10 second timer to time out in a nother 8 seconds once it does it sends a pulse to the other timers to inititiate a REM event. THis is done to make sure it really is a REM event and not just motion artifacts from rolling around.
There are no extra timers. This design was for basic functions of REM detection the more advanced functions that you have been asking about are in the Pro version. Such as: Dream Alarm programming, Light/Sound Functions to bring you into “State”, Charting REM events during the night, Other timer functions such as sleep delay, etc
If you are not getting triggers during the night I can increase the sensitivity for you and I can change the LEDs to other colors but that’s it for the Basic.
Bruce
I sent you an email requesting further information; a more comprehensive owner’s manual, operating instructions, a tutorial or even a schematic. You sent me nothing but asked me to call you. I called you numerous times and left messages but never received a callback. Previous to that, I sent many emails concerning the status of my DreamMaker order. Many went unanswered. I am not used to being treated like this as a paying customer. What was I supposed to do Bruce?
Bruce,
Sorry about not getting back to you sooner. My daughter had some college presentation so we were gone all week end.
Well, it looks like we are still at an impasse on this DreamAlarm issue. To say that this is an “advanced function” available only on the “PRO” model will not win any supporters.
Increasing the trigger sensitivity or changing the LED colors won’t do anything to let me know that lucidity cues were given in the first place. That’s why the DreamAlarm function is so vitally important. The NovaDreamer’s DreamAlarm function provided for an opportunity to wake up from a dream five minutes after REM detection and the lucidity cues were given so that a person could review the dream and try to determine what or if any dream signals were received.
Otherwise, I would just hook up some Christmas lights to a lamp timer, set to go off every 90 minutes and hope I get lucky. Maybe, I would set an alarm clock to go off every 95 minutes to help the dream recall.
One of my first projects was a car alarm using a 555 timer. I used the courtesy light as a trigger and a simple RC network to honk the horn for a short while, then it went back into a “listening mode”.
I think your design may have too many extraneous events for the timers. I see a 15 second astable circuit for the LED and sound cues, and there is the 40 minute sleep delay. What are you using the other timers for? Are you using the IR detection as the primary trigger? If you had it in a “listening mode”, then the IR detection could be used as a trigger. Use one timer to “debounce” and then go into the astable for the LED & sound cues. That signal to start the astable could also be used to start a “DreamAlarm” countdown timer going into another astable for the actual “DreamAlarm” with the RC network to reset the whole thing.
There as numerous 555 timer webpages on the net with sample circuits that you may find helpful. I had gotten a 556 timer pin-out diagram and had thought to reverse-engineer the DreamMaker since you are so reluctant to provide a schematic.
Steve Pertubal
From: “Bruce Gelerter” bruceg@wellnesstools.com >To: “Steve & Leah Pertubal” rassle_co@hotmail.com >Subject: RE: DreamMaker Review (2) >Date: Thu, 14 Apr 2005 10:40:14 -0600 > >OK - all the timers are used up. Several are just for the beep sequence. >Timers are used for the REM detection as well. For example there is a 2 sec >astable timer constantly sending pulses to a 10 second monostable timer
Hi Steve,
I have one timer left over in one of the 556 packages. If I can work it into the dream alarm would that be the feature that would win you over - to make DreamMaker basic a good or great value?? I also have extra dip switches that I can use for a possible timer setting - any suggestions on their use?
Bruce
-----Original Message-----
From: Steve & Leah Pertubal [mailto:rassle_co@hotmail.com]
Sent: Monday, April 18, 2005 6:36 AM
To: bruceg@wellnesstools.com
Subject: DreamMaker Review (3)
Bruce,
Sorry about not getting back to you sooner. My daughter had some college presentation so we were gone all week end.
Well, it looks like we are still at an impasse on this DreamAlarm issue. To say that this is an “advanced function” available only on the “PRO” model will not win any supporters.
Bruce,
As I have alluded to before, yes, the DreamAlarm function is the most important feature next to the REM detection. One of the extra DIP switches could be used to select different sleep delays. How about sending me a schematic? It’s really hard to make out some of these resistor values.
Steve
From: “Bruce Gelerter” bruceg@wellnesstools.com >To: “Steve & Leah Pertubal” rassle_co@hotmail.com >Subject: RE: DreamMaker Review (3) >Date: Mon, 18 Apr 2005 09:37:02 -0600 > >Hi Steve, >I have one timer left over in one of the 556 packages. If I can work it into >the dream alarm would that be the feature that would win you over - to make >DreamMaker basic a good or great value?? I also have extra dip switches that >I can use for a possible timer setting - any suggestions on their use? >Bruce > >
Steve, >This is a brand new product release with a patent pending, I can’t send you >a schematic. You don’t have to design anything anyway. Just tell me what >changes you would like to see, such as the dream alarm and if there is >enough resources on the board then I will put it in. the PCB is pretty >packed already and I can’t fit much more on this board - but possibly the >dream alarm. That would be about it. >Bruce Gelerter > > > -----Original Message----- >From: Steve & Leah Pertubal [mailto:rassle_co@hotmail.com] >Sent: Monday, April 18, 2005 11:35 PM >To: bruceg@wellnesstools.com >Subject: DreamMaker Review (4) > > > Bruce, > > As I have alluded to before, yes, the DreamAlarm function is the most >important feature next to the REM detection.
Bruce,
That is just too funny, I’ll bet the patent lawyer asked for his fee up front in cash. So all I have to do, is add a couple of RC networks and I can steal your patent and business. The circuit is not that complicated and I should have it mapped out real soon. Then I can figure out where to put the DreamAlarm circuits. Well, I’m sorry that I can’t help you any further. Good Luck.
Steve
From: “Bruce Gelerter” bruceg@wellnesstools.com >To: “Steve & Leah Pertubal” rassle_co@hotmail.com >Subject: RE: DreamMaker Review (4) >Date: Tue, 19 Apr 2005 01:32:55 -0600 > >Steve, >This is a brand new product release with a patent pending, I can’t send you >a schematic. You don’t have to design anything anyway. Just tell me what >changes you would like to see, such as the dream alarm and if there is >enough resources on the board then I will put it in. the PCB is pretty >packed already and I can’t fit much more on this board - but possibly the >dream alarm. That would be about it. >Bruce Gelerter > > > -----Original Message----- >From: Steve & Leah Pertubal [mailto:rassle_co@hotmail.com] >Sent: Monday, April 18, 2005 11:35 PM >To: bruceg@wellnesstools.com >Subject: DreamMaker Review (4) > > > Bruce, > > As I have alluded to before, yes, the DreamAlarm function is the most >important feature next to the REM detection.
Well - there you have it ! I tried being nice but it seems that all along you were just a jealous half baked technician trying to put down the DreamMaker design and at the same time try to steal it. I will pray for you - maybe. You won’t get anywhere with that kind of thinking - good luck!
-----Original Message-----
From: Steve & Leah Pertubal [mailto:rassle_co@hotmail.com]
Sent: Wednesday, April 20, 2005 2:59 AM
To: bruceg@wellnesstools.com
Subject: DreamMaker Review (5)
Bruce,
That is just too funny, I’ll bet the patent lawyer asked for his fee up front in cash. So all I have to do, is add a couple of RC networks and I can steal your patent and business. The circuit is not that complicated and I should have it mapped out real soon. Then I can figure out where to put the DreamAlarm circuits. Well, I’m sorry that I can’t help you any further. Good Luck.
Steve
From: “Bruce Gelerter” bruceg@wellnesstools.com >To: “Steve & Leah Pertubal” rassle_co@hotmail.com >Subject: RE: DreamMaker Review (4) >Date: Tue, 19 Apr 2005 01:32:55 -0600 > >Steve, >This is a brand new product release with a patent pending, I can’t send you >a schematic. You don’t have to design anything anyway. Just tell me what >changes you would like to see, such as the dream alarm and if there is >enough resources on the board then I will put it in. the PCB is pretty >packed already and I can’t fit much more on this board - but possibly the >dream alarm. That would be about it. >Bruce Gelerter > > > -----Original Message----- >From: Steve & Leah Pertubal [mailto:rassle_co@hotmail.com] >Sent: Monday, April 18, 2005 11:35 PM >To: bruceg@wellnesstools.com >Subject: DreamMaker Review (4) > > > Bruce, > > As I have alluded to before, yes, the DreamAlarm function is the most >important feature next to the REM detection.
Bruce, Bruce, Bruce,
You seriously do not get it. I was just being nice to string you along. To see if you actually wanted to do the right thing and straighten out your DreamMaker fiasco. Apparently not. I was willing to help you with the DreamAlarm circuitry, which really is not that difficult to implement.
Then you come back with this totally assinine crap about a “patent pending”. Well, Bruce, do you hold the patent? You’re a fool, if you tried to patent that half-ass design and what does that have to do with giving me the schematic. Just for your information, I am building a Kvasar.
Anyway, coming to Google and LD4all among others…really soon, my complete DreamMaker review, including emails with the CEO of the company… hope you didn’t incriminate yourself so badly that it hurts your bottom line. I hope you did not hock the farm to finance your DreamMaker scam.
My “kind of thinking” as I stated in my earlier email is to warn everyone I can about your crappy DreamMaker and you and your questionable business practices. I feel I got ripped off, but I’m going to eat this loss. Finally, I don’t get even, I get ahead, and I’m going to enjoy fucking you…hard.
Good Luck, really (smirk)
From: “Bruce Gelerter” bruceg@wellnesstools.com >To: “Steve & Leah Pertubal” rassle_co@hotmail.com >Subject: RE: DreamMaker Review (5) >Date: Wed, 20 Apr 2005 11:38:43 -0600 > >Well - there you have it ! I tried being nice but it seems that all along >you were just a jealous half baked technician trying to put down the >DreamMaker design and at the same time try to steal it. I will pray for >you - maybe. You won’t get anywhere with that kind of thinking - good luck!
Bruce is right in one way: the “advanced” features on the DreamMaker were advertized only for the Pro, which is much more expensive (for no particular reason, the extra components/software programming was minimal).
Other than that, he just used big words for nothing. Apparently the “EMG” didn’t really work and they took it out… my belief is he doesn’t even properly understand EMG and used EDA (electrodermal activity, or gsr) instead…
Other claims (such an affiliation with the Lucidity Institute) are also just lies to get people’s trust.
The whole thing is just a huge scam to me.
As for the Kvasar, good luck with that! i never got mine to work properly, i think the IR sensor wasn’t placed properly over my eye, but i hear this problem also occured with the DreamMaker (where it picks up eye fluttering, but not subtle eye movement)… After toying around with the placement and breaking two sensors (which I had to order through my college as samples because they wouldn’t ship for under 50$ and i couldn’t find them anywhere else) I gave up on that and decided IR detection wasn’t reliable enough.
Right now I’m trying to come up with a design that uses EDA primarily, so if you’re into electronics and you think you could help, let me know. The idea is to turn skin resistance (which changes) into sound frequency and plug that into a computer through the line in. From there, everything is software based and the output to be made on one of those cheap, easy to build, lpt driven light machines (or alternatively, other cues, like, sound, vibrations, etc). Downpart is the computer connection…
We don’t know if it will work (not knowing how reliable EDA is compared to IR detection, maybe it’s not that good at all), but it’s all about the research anyway. Apparently skin resistance drops significantly during REM… but we’ll see.
I think it would only be proper since you pointed out that “Bruce is right in one way”, that in my opinion, Bruce is so definitely wrong in possibly hundreds of ways. Someone earlier posted that where there is smoke, there is fire;where for every one person that complains, there a lot more people that just say “forget it”.
Galvonic skin resistance to detect REM… way too complex for me. I still think IR detection is the simplest way to go, I’ll let you know how the Kvasar works out.
I just went to the DreamMaker site. There are now testimonials from “satisfied customers”… most of them from Colorado Springs…hahaha
Did anyone notice that Bruce just dropped off of this forum after people uncovered his past?
I’d suggest that this exchange basically confirms the story that one finds when searching the net. This subject might be worth a sticky topic of its own – It’s a story that’s been discussed on this board a fair bit already.
To wit:
*Inflated, misleading and frequently revised (downwards) claims and assertations. Poorly designed, poorly built products, that don’t perform as advertised, let alone accomplish the desired goal. That’s assuming the product actually arrives after it’s been paid for.
*Generally poor service, lots of excuses, and special pleading, denial of responsability. There are occassional “example cases” of better service but they appear to be strongly atypical cases (and generally these people aren’t – as far as I can tell – well known to any community where they appear or are refered to) . The Better Business Bureau, bulletin boards like this one, “fraud watch” style websites and organaziations, and and a surprising number of spcially created websites document an ongoing pattern of dissatisfied costomers.
*A pronounced tendency to blame the customer for not accepting excuses, or for not considering promises to someday deal with the problem as equivilent to actually dealing with the problem. Often accompanied (several exchanges down the line) by variations on the “if you had been more constructive/nicer/more trusting, I would have fixed your problem yesterday” speech – often completely ignoring the actual content of the original complaint.
And a question for anyone in the know -- what exactly about this product would be patentable?
As far as I know, anything that is legitimately patentable has already been patented by LaBerge or The Lucidity Institute (which perhaps wasn't really properly patentable, but at least the case could be made) and is probably near expiry date by now anyways. Certainly nothing in Gelerter's device get's around "prior art" considerations.
You know, no one would be here with this problem letting people know " HEY it’s a rip off, save your money" if the dreammaker cost $99 dollars and the dreammaker pro cost $149.
Well I personally would not buy any of this guys products.
Anyway, the dream maker(and its problems) has been discussed many times before: DreamMaker - the new novadreamer Dream Maker - Phoen’s Personal Review
Perhaps a mod could merge all the dream maker topics into one thread for people to read.
I am sorry to be beating a dead horse, just going on and on about this. I wish I had done my research and found this forum before buying the DreamMaker.
reddog, I hope you are wrong. Yes, more people would be inclined to just say “forget it”, but getting ripped off is no deal, at any price.
i think the price has a lot to do with unsatisfied customers, and i don’t see why that’s wrong in any way. At least you know for 99$ you don’t expect spectacular features that were claimed to exist… If it comes and you see it doesn’t have EMG, then whatever, it was 99$ and the price is somewhat justified (25 - 50$ for components MAX, and 50$ for research/profit)…
But when you ask way too much for something that (not that it doesn’t work, it may work, but it’s not what it was claimed to be) of course people will get upset
You seem to know about this stuff alot rassle. You talked about novadreamer as if you used it. Does novadreamer work? Readding what you have posted I believe that it works better then dreammaker, but if the dreammaker doesn’t work, that isn’t saying much.
EDIT: also wanted to know if it would do what the little news clip showed, be able to walk you into a WILD in 15mins. Something I have only done twice in my life. Most my lucid dreams don’t last long(maybe 3mins), most the time I wake. Last night I was looking at my feet and my right foot had two more feet on the other side of it, was a dead give away. I got out of bed and walked out side and the sky was black, strange because every time before the sky was purple and gray with lighting. The spining thing worked also I did that for the first time other wise I wouldn’t have made it out side.
reddog, I don’t know a whole lot, but as a technician, I tend to look at things logically. I found the NovaDreamer operations manual online so I had that as a basis on which to judge the DreamMaker. From researching the NovaDreamer, I knew a little of its operation, so when the DreamMaker came out advertising all these great improvements with a pre-order price of $200 and seeing how the NovaDreamer was no longer being produced and the remaining stock selling for upwards of $700 for the Basic model… yeah, I took that blind leap. Fool I was.
I was thinking of selling it on eBay, but I would be just as bad as Bruce Gelerter, ripping people off. So I am going to eat this loss, but I am going to do my part to warn people about Bruce Gelerter.
He seems a bit childish for a company CEO. Certainly not professional. I think he’s got manufacturer-customer misunderstandings too. I don’t mean to be a jerk, but frankly, you don’t give a paying customer a sob story guilt trip. You give them the product as described or you give them their money back, how dare they try to make the customer(who was completely deceived and ripped off [even if he’s telling the truth and that wasn’t his intention]) feel guilty for complaining??
this is a pretty funny exchange of e-mails.