Absolutely!! Kerry handled himself. Bush didn’t look as if he had been in the debate at all. I was embarrased for Bush and ended up turning off the television.
On a more comical side of politics. Way back when Bush was running for President, this comedy show called Saturday Night Live did a skit with Will Farrell call “Bush hunting”. Where our now president was out hunting with the former president (his dad). It was really funny. And Will played President Bush to a T. 
Loony… woot… 
HEEEEEEELLLLLPPPPPP! BUSH IS GOING TO WIN AGAIIIIN!!! 
I somehow know bush will win by a close vote! hits her head to the padded wall hard
Stay posivite DM7!!! 
…and the rest who cheer 4 Kerry!!! 
Yes even some republican commentators have said that Kerry looked more presidential and statesman like then Bush.
Tonight is the VP debate. Can’t wait to see how it turns out.
Form everything I have heard from non partisan sources nothing in the movie can be disproved. With that said I do not think you should believe every word of it either. However, the parts which I believe to be true do make some very important points.
Again the answer is yes and no depending on the situation. For example: My step father could have been anything he wanted. He could have been a doctor, a lawyer whatever. He had all educational options open to him. Yet, he choose to be a fireman. Why? Because it is what he always wanted to do. Not because it was the only job available. There are plenty of people who enlist for the same reason and that is good. However, We are the wealthiest country in the world and no citizens choices should be limited to enlist in the armed services or poverty.
Yet. 
People who turn 18 still have to register with the selective service. Why?
Sure it does.
As much as I would love to pounce on that statement it would likely spin this hole thread off topic. So I will bite my tongue for now but, look forward to having that debate another day.
So many ignorant post, So little time… 
Whats wrong with that? You said people who where so poor they had no choice but to join the army. Ok maybe not all of them are bums but you have to be pretty far down before your HAVE to join the army. I mean what do I make? 12,000 a year, now thats poor. I am not in the army though.
Basicly you would be down to where you can’t afford food before you have to join the army. What your really talking about is anyone below middle class because we are all poor. No one there HAS to join, they might want to because it offers them a better life, but how is that forcing anything?
And no the government doesn’t make people poor. To say they do is just stupid.
Also did you click that link? Theres a big list of things proven untrue about the movie.
I really think you should click on that link and read all the things listed as untrue. Then you can come back and say you think the movie is still mostly true.
I know how you feel. I am sooo tempted to educate but I will exercise restraint.
All you have to do is look at who wrote that site and why.
I am not saying that Michael Mores move is flawless. He is a person with an agenda and one should view his material with healthy skepticism. Even with that in mind, yes I do believe he made some important points in his movie that are worthy of our attention.
You might want to re think that one. I mean really think about it.
Anyway back to the election:
I watched the VP debate last night. As soon as it was over Fox immediately projected Cheney as the clear winner. Again, we must have been watching different debates. It seemed to be more of a stalemate to me with both sides holding their own against each other. I would say that they both did well. I don’t think either candidate really helped or hindered their running mate in any substantive way. Cheney scored a few hits about Edwards lack of experience in politics and Edwards attacked the questionable activities of Cheney when he was the VP of Hallaberton. Both drew blood on each other throughout the debate but, neither scored a knockout.
The next debate is on Friday between Kerry and Bush. This will be a town forum type of debate where the audience gets to ask the candidates questions. This is the one that bush did not want. Anyway it should be interesting!
Just look at who made the movie and why. It was made just to bash bush, but you went and watched that. Its only fair you go read that site. I kind of wonder how he can have an important point, if the base of the point and nearly everything supporting it is a lie.
All the government does is tax people but that hardly counts as making people poor, as you need to make money before you can pay any taxes.
I am kind of confused here. Moore makes a movie full of lies to bash bush but he has important points. A person makes a list but because he doesn’t like moore its not worth even reading. You think the government makes people poor but you bash parts of the government for hiring people and lifting them out of poverty. All the while you don’t even say why you think any of the stuff but just make vague posts saying something is wrong or right, then moving on to calling others names. I guess I see why so many people are for kerry now.
Alric wrote:
The government does way more than just tax people. And by enlisting in the service that doesn’t take anyone out of poverty. The government also restricts services and discontinues them. Those same services would assist those living in poverty to get a chance and get out of it. The choices that are made are for their benefit not really for that of the “people”.
Right now as far as the debate goes Kerry handled himself very well and bush looked to be unfocused and baffled. But neither of them actually brought up what the plan for Iraq is. We keep sending soldiers over and now they are starting to call people back into active duty that have been out for 10 years. If they don’t pull our soldiers out of Iraq in 6 months guess what, there’s going to be a draft. How else will the USA be able to do anything. George W. messed up with that war. Now that country has absolutely no order. Women/girls are being raped, kidnapped and killed every day.
I mean everyone wants to eradicate all possible threat to the US and it’s allies. But come one, If we can’t keep our own back yard clean why the hell are we cleaning up someone else’s. Especially when they like the disarry they live in.
I’m confused as to why Kerry is seen as the flip flopper. The only reason people think that is because bush’s propaganda forces it into your heads, because the polls told him that voters see him as more confident and decisive. Bwahaha this movie cracks me up:
clickums
Anyway, theres not gonna be a draft, so don’t get too stressed outl
-It wouldn’t pass in congress, and if it did there would be riots
-the people who introduced the bill, and who are backing it, are liberal (i think its just to scare people into voting for kerry)
after all, fear is the best way to control people
hitler knew it, bush knows it
kerry knows it too…
dun dun dunnnnnn
This is an interesting read
but he does get my vote, i’m on the “anyone but bush 2004” campaign
First I did in fact read the site. Unfortunately I found many of the “59 deceits in Fahrenheit 911" to be erroneous. Some I believe to be false as a matter of fact and others just can’t be proved either way. I applied a healthy skepticism to Michael mores movie considering (as I stated above)the fact that he is a person with an agenda. I only took from the movie the things that I found to be credible. I suggest you apply the same healthy skepticism to that site. If you honestly do so, I think you will see the “59 deceits” is no great bastion of truth.
Well as I said above I did read it. I read it when it was first posted. Have you seen seen Mores movie?
Well you are distorting what I said. I have not bashed the government about this. We live in the wealthiest country in the world and I beleive everyone should have more choices open to them. That is all I am saying. Nothing more and nothing less. I am simply saying that we can and should do better than we are.
Actually I think it was really just to make a point. Kind of like a protest vote. Noone expected it to pass. In fact it did not pass it was voted on and defeated yesterday.
That Reminds me of the Bush v Clinton race. Back then many people said they would vote for Micky Mouse over Bush.
So whens the 2nd part of the debate? 
Tonight, 7 p.m. ET!
Regarding the military issue, it may be true that there are even more people in poverty than those reported by the U.S. government. However, the numbers enlisted in the military are concrete. The more poor people there are, the smaller percentage of them are in the military. This undercuts the notion that if you’re poor you have to go into the military. If instead of 3% of the poor being in the military, maybe it’s 2%. Regardless, more than 9 out of 10 people seem to get along without joining up. Like I said, if it’s even possible to have a military that is purely voluntary, we’ve got it in the United States.
Of course, to completely eliminate financial motives for joining the army, we would have to pay our soldiers nothing. That wouldn’t be right, would it?
That is actually not quite true. That was the hole point behind the military draft bill that was defeated earlier this week. It is why they did it. Many congressional leaders felt that it was unfair that the majority of the people fighting in Iraq right now are either poor or minority troops. They wanted to bring this issue up before us for debate. Of course even the people who supported or sponsored the bill did not vote for it. They never intended to bring back the draft. They just wanted to raise public awareness about this issue. Unfortunately do to the recent hurricanes, the debates and other world events, the bill did not get the expected press coverage.
Anyway back th the debate:
The second presidential debate will start in about 10 minutes.
If you are voting in the upcoming election. Please go check out factcheck.org and do not listen to one bit of commercials supporting either canidate, no matter who you are for. Both are just as misleading and both stretch things quite a bit.
That aside. I think Kerry would make a better president. I admit that I am sick of Bush, and I don’t even like him. But if I felt he would make a better president, I would support him.
One thing that I notice is that Bush throws blame of a lot of current problems at the senate. He never throws the blame at the house, or his administration. He fails to communicate that if any problems have arised even with voting, that it is due to the Republicans. Republicans are the majority of the house and senate, but that fact has been very over looked.
Well round 2 of the presidential debates are over and to be honest I am a little disappointed. Don’t get me wrong. Both candidates did very well. Though I do not agree with his views, Bush greatly improved his performance this round. Bush did loose his temper once and argued with the moderator to reply to comment Kerry made. Throughout the debate both went on the attack and scored some good points on each other. However, when all is said and done neither came out on top as a clear winner. In the final analysis I am not sure this debate will change the minds of anyone who is not already commitid one way or the other.
The third and final debate is next Wednesday.
i didnt watch the debate. fox is biased.
it doesent matter though, the president has little power.
the power is where the money is.
we’re running out of oil.
you know, fossil fuels.
oil = money.
in a capitalistic society, it’s inevetible that those with money will be making the real decisions.
your best bet now is to kill your tv and lay low so when they reinstate the draft you can move to canada without a hassle.
I think your biased.