Post Election Support Group

Lucid Lounge
61

Same is true for police and firefighters, but they’re both voluntary. I wouldn’t want to draft for those positions either.

Anyway, I watched the second debate and was impressed by Bush’s improved performance. He didn’t knock Kerry out the way Kerry knocked Bush out in the first debate, but Bush still clearly won. I flipped through all of the channels to see how the pundits were reacting immediately after the debate. All of the Republicans seemed very pleased with themselves, and all of the Democrats looked depressed.

Kerry really could have used a win here. I think a lot of people were expecting him to win, especially considering his last debate and the fact that so much of this was centered on domestic issues. If Kerry won both the first and second debates by a good margin, he would be elected. He failed this time. However, the race is still open and the third debate could decide things.

62

Did Bush cheat? Is he stupid enough to have somebody else to do the work for him?

We were talking about that in mirc with TOmas, etc…

Here are two links that you might want to check out… if that’s true… we need to expose Bush.

nyc.indymedia.org/newswire/displ … /index.php

Other reason to vote for kerry. :razz:

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jcnot4me.com/Items/spoofs/th … monkey.htm

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lol yeah i have seen that monkey-bush picture before. :happy:

Found other site… “Bush Must Go”… interesting to read though. :happy: jcnot4me.com/Items/Misc%20To … h_Must_Go_

Edited: I found Bush’s and Kerry’s record of military site…
news.findlaw.com/legalnews/lit/e … /docs.html

You’ll find that kerry has recieved way more of metals/special recognizations than Bush. Indeed, a interesting and important fact.

Edited again: bellaciao.org/en/article.php3?id_article=3564 practical explaination for that box shown on bush’s back. But, you never know… bush is known to be stupid… no offenses to pro-bush people >_<

Edited again and again: answers.google.com/answers/threadview?id=403594 Interesting… it’s about a guy paid $20 for his question about bush wearing a earpiece… a lot of researching is dovated to this.

65

Well that is true however we don’t force police and firefighters to keep their jobs if they want to quit. In the “all volunteer service” you enlist for a specified period of time. When that time expires you are allowed to quit if you want or you can re-enlist. At least that is the way it is supposed to work. However, right not soldiers who want to quit whin their tour is up are being forced to re-enlist. :sad:

I don’t want people to continue to misunderstand me. I have made several attempts to make my position clear. I have no problem with people joining the armed service to improve their situation, attain a better education etc. I would just like people to have more options open to them.

I disagree. As I said above Bush did greatly improved his performance. I think both did very well but not great. However, I think both were just speaking to their base. If you support Bush and his views then you would think he won. The same goes for Kerry’s performance. I don’t think either changed the minds of many voters with this debate.

Anyway this is off topic but, I have seen a few news reports that the Prime Minister of Australia is expected to loose re-election because of his support for the war. If his opponent wins he has pledged to pull his troops out of Iraq. If there are any Australians here, Is this true? If it is I think that is very telling. If even Australia won’t stay with us it shows how we are truly losing respect of our closest allies.

66

Not really off topic because this may influence the presidential campaign, another country leaving the “coalition of the willing” would be bad news for Bush. But John Howard has actually won the election and has begun his fourth term as Prime Minister.

Another thing that may have an influence: the Afghan elections. All opposition candidates refuse to accept the results. It’s quite a chaos. You cannot make a country democratic in a few years. I’m afraid we’ll see the same results in Iraq (if not worse).

67

i’m voting nader or libertarian unless kerry has a chance of carrying the state of Oklahoma, which he doesn’t …

in my COLLEGE class today people were saying we’d see more terrorism if Kerry was elected and were saying they’d start a militia and stuff

the milita might be a joke but it’s saddening really… Kerry’s no prime candidate but … GOD… did you hear what he said about abortion in the 2nd debate? He was masterful… he clearly showed that he has religious convictions but he will NOT under any circumstances try to legislate them… that he will stand by the constitution… and he explained in REAL WORLD terms why he thought that parental notification was bad, as in the case of a daughter being raped by her dad and trying to get an abortion, and how it needs to be done by a JUIDICIAL REVIEW…

and all Bush says… in reponse is WELL YOU VOTED AGAINST IT!

the man is a fucking idiot who must be color blind… there is more to life than BLACK AND WHITE and anyone that likes Bush’s … you know… subpar moral reasoning, on par with maybe a 6 year old… really scares me…

we do not need black and white in this world… nothing is ever that simple… a leader might sometimes have to take a black and white stance, but we desperately need ones that sees all the world’s colors, and I am confident Kerry will… better than Bush… and thusly any laws he will draft will reflect … you know… commonsense… not black and white mentality.

How can people say he’d be a worse leader than Bush? I can understand being uncertain of what he’ll do with the war but he’s a better speaker, he seems a bit smarter… he is not funded by AS MANY evil corporations as Bush… he valus the DAMNED CONSTITUTION! (which Bush doesn’t, he wants to segregate gay people… SEPERATE BUT EQUAL IS UNCONSTITUTIONAL AND WAS RULED SO A LONG TIME AGO) … he wouldn’t be an arrogant cock to the world and would respect their opinions more.

you need a leader that will act if action is needed, but he needs to make the right actions and decisions… and he needs to do so in such a way as to try not to make the situation worse (the war in Iraq created more terror than it destroyed, I can almost guarantee it… and it made the world hate us so badly… big wrong move being arrogant and rushy in Bush’s book)

you know, this man, Bush, he has the world’s unwavering support in the wake of 9/11 and in just one year he throws it all away… America could have been a respected (out of sympathy and sorrow) nation again… nope… Bush flushes it down the toilet.

You know… but people think Kerry would be a horrible leader… I disagree… he wont’ be much different than Bush, first of all, and second he wont’ try to legislate religious agendas (which many people seem to think is good) and probably won’t compromise our liberties as much.

but I’m voting Nader or Libertarian unless Kerry is close to Bush in the Oklahoma polls.

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HolyReality- I think you just brought up an important point. It seems that one of the main differences between Bush and Kerry (and Republicans and Democrats for the most part) is that Bush sees things in Black and white while Kerry and most democrats understand how complex things really are. This might also explain how Bush is still in, and may even be winning, the polls right now- the common people, or anyone not very Knowledgeable about politics for that matter, can better understand the black and white policies of Bush than Kerry’s more elaborate and possibly confusing arguments. In my opinion, Kerry won the second debate because his logic was stronger, but Bush appeared stronger because he was better able to drive home his black and white ideas. Maybe Kerry should stoop to Bush’s level- there are many points of attack against Bush.

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Thats what they both do, attack each other all day long. One of the biggests problems I have with kerry is that he never talks about his positions and he wont explain his record. Bush can get away with it a little more because most people know a lot more about him.

70

That is a big problem with the debates and the political system as a hole. All the issues effecting this campaign are very complex and noone could passably summerize them in a 90 second chimerical or answer to a question in a debate.

I wish Kerry would do what Clinton did and paid to have his town forums on TV and went on MTV and such. We got a lot more information that way. The problem is further compounded if you do not live in a swing state. The candidates don’t spend much money on ads or hold town forms in those states.

However, I do not think that Kerry’s positions are unclear. I think it is the news media that confuses things. They all mix the news with there personal opinions so, the water gets more muddied leaving people more confused. Have you tried going to Kerry’s web site to get more information.

I can understand why you feel that way. I wish 3rd party votes translated to seats in the house and senate like they do in Canada and other European countries. That way even if the 3rd party candidate did not win at least the votes would count for something.

Last debate is tomorrow.

71

Bush will have an enormous media advantage now over Kerry. Sinclair Corporation which owns and operates 64 television stations , many of which reach the populace in the critical battle states of america has announced that it will begin airing a one hour anti Kerry documentary . They declared that their corporation is a conservative republican company and intends to air several anti Kerry adds and documentaries.

This annuncement today, has infuriated democrats who argue that television networks should not be allowed to continually broadcast political propoganda, and that the FCC should investigate the matter immediately.

In my opinion I think the republican party is comprised of unscroupulous underhanded dirty politics. :bored:

72

Is this fair? When they do it to us- No. When we do it to them- yes.

Not long ago I thought Michael More should have waited to release his movie Fahrenheit 911 until it was closer to the election. However, guess what movie just came out to video stores a week ago? :smile: With only a few weeks to go until the election. A friend of mine is a manager of a video store and has a hole wall full of Michael More’s movie and it is always empty because so many people are renting it.

Not to mention every week we have: Real Time with Bill Mar on HBO.

73

Yesterday was the final debate and Bush took a beating from Kerry. Even the Fox poll declared Kerry the winner at 60%. :thumbs:

The topic of this debate was domestic issues like the jobs, the economy etc. This is a topic where Kerry clearly had the upper hand and Bush is very weak and out of touch. However, I was a little frustrated about one thing. While this debate touched on many things including: health care, jobs, abortion, gay marriage, and they even slipped in a question about Iraq. Yet there were no questions about the environment :sad: which I think is an important issue.

Anyway, only 19 days till the election. For the first time I am feeling more optimistic about Kerry’s chances of winning. :smile:

74

They talked about the environment in the second debate, I was almost ready to throw TV out of the window when I heard Bush defending his environmental policies :grrr:

I’m glad Kerry is the winner of the second debate, but now the Cheneys are moaning about Kerry mentioning Cheneys daughter and I hope this will not affect the polls :neutral:

75

Lets just hope this all ends up in a good way. BTW…insnt there a 3rd debate?

76

The third debate was wednesday evening :tongue:

77

I am not american and I can’t understand, is it hard for people to chose? I mean if you are conservative or right, you vote for Bush. If you are liberal or left you vote for Kerry. It must be very easy to make up you mind about who to vote for.

I wish we didn’t depend so much on america’s economy because then we non-americans could all just laught at the idiocy, like if abortion becomes forbidden. Actually i think i will laught if that happens. “Welcome back to the 18-hundreds…” :smile:

78

Thats true, thats why the debates don’t really mean anything. It was something like 6% who are undecided. Of course everything is split even so the 6% will mean a lot.

79

Right now our country is evenly divided that is why it is so hard to predict who is going to win. This division is even worse than the 2000 election. Unless something drastic happens and one candidate wins by a lot I am sure there will be lots of recounts and court challenges.

Yes they did and I definitely agree with your feeling. I just wish it was brought up again in the 3rd debate. It is another area where Kerry is strong.

This year they are talking about the “undecided” voter even more than previous elections. What I do not understand is how anyone can be undecided. :confused: These two candidates offer radicly different approaches to almost everything. What is there to be undecided about?

Anyway, some commentator said the other day that. “never in our countries history did a candidate win all 3 debates then go on to loose the election”. If that is historically true lets hope it holds true in this election as well. In all honesty, I can not say Kerry won all 3 debates. In my opinion debate # 2 was a tie. However, it appears that Kerry benefitted from it more than Bush did.

80

Theres always a first for everything.