Some doors should not be opened

Beyond Dreaming
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DISCLAIMER: I know that what I am about to post here is against popular opinion and will probably annoy / anger many people who have been investing so much time and energy into lucid dreaming, but I feel responsible to prevent as many of you as I can from opening the same miserable door that I have. If I can prevent just ONE of you from getting to the point I am at now, the time I spent writing this post will not have gone in vain.

Hey everyone. This is going to be a long read, so I apologize in advance, but I feel this warning is needed. As you can see by my join date, I have been practicing lucid dreaming for a long time now. Over the course of my time here, I contributed in various ways by writing a couple articles for the Lucid Library and composing a technique that a lot of people had great success with. Many, many years has lucid dreaming been a big priority in my life. However, I am coming to regret tampering with this.

Near the beginning of 2012, I was approached in a lucid dream by an older looking man in a suit and tie. The vibe that I picked up from him was different than what I felt from my autonomous dream characters. He seemed more alive and conscious of what was going on than they did. He extended his hand and asked me if I would like to make a deal. Being utterly creeped out by the feeling this man was invading my lucid dream, I declined and told him to bug off.

Immediately I found myself in bed, lying in sleep paralysis with a black cat with no face sitting next to my pillow staring a hole through my eyes. The terror was extreme and unimaginable. I wasn’t a Christian at the time and had no belief in Jesus so I just laid there completely unable to escape while this demon psychologically harassed me for a good 5 to 10 minutes, which seemed even longer than it probably was.

Ever since then, I have consistently been attacked by demons in the early morning hours, during sleep paralysis, approximately 3 or 4 mornings a week every week. The attacks are always terrifying and have involved being clawed at, strangled, suffocated, electrocuted with energy and even raped. Yes, raped and I am a male. Not the most pleasant experiences. Combine the physical pain of the aforementioned types of experiences with the overwhelming sensation of pure, innescapable terror and you can get a rough glimpse of what I and many others who experience this must have been through.

Before any of you say this is a completely scientific phenomenon, it is not. Sleep paralysis is a natural phenomenon, yes, and sometimes it’s natural to be conscious during it. Over the last 9 years I have been practicing lucid dreaming, I have casually been in and out of sleep paralysis hundreds of times, but the difference was there were no demons or feelings of a dark presence in the room. Sleep paralysis is normal, yes, however demonic attacks DURING sleep paralysis are NOT normal.

Until spring of 2013, nothing I had tried would make these experiences stop. I could try holding my breath to escape them, I could try shaking myself awake or crying out for help but none of those attempts ever succeeded in waking me up. I was forced to live through 5 to 10 minutes of unimaginable horror every episode. That was until I swallowed my pride and did what many people had suggested prior and to call out in the name of Jesus Christ for aid. The first time I tried it, the experience ended abruptly. I still thought that the Bible and everything christianity taught was a ridiculous story to try and guilt trip people into being good slaves to the system so I brushed it off as mere coincidence.

However, every time sleep paralysis set in and demons invaded my room, the same trick worked wonders to bring me out of it. After enough times, I decided there must be something to it. I started investigating the Bible and found other stories of previously atheist people who have been down the same path as I have where occult practices (such as lucid dreaming and astral projection) had lead to endless night time demonic assaults and ended up finding Christ through witnessing his name stopping the attacks.

Have the attacks stopped? No. They are less frequent than they once were, but they still happen. However, they last no more than 20 to 30 seconds now because I know to instantly call out to Jesus to wake me up.

I have had other spiritual experiences that I find too sacred to describe online during these situations recently that have solidified my faith in Christ and, as terrifying as these attacks have been, I am grateful to have them as they have given me a pure knowledge that the gospel of Christ is true – which extends far beyond mere faith.

I urge you all to stop heading down this path. Consciousness in sleep opens doorways to dimensions where Satan has his kingdom and you do NOT want to experience it in the same way I had to. If you’re not already christian, it’s not like I am going to call you to repentence and say you have to turn to Christ or anything. Choose whichever path you choose (buddhist, hindu, islam, atheist), but I am just begging you not to go down this one. However, Jesus does love all of you.

While I can’t literally go back and kick these demons in the nuts for the last couple years of pure hell and torment, I can metaphorically kick them in the nuts by preventing them from gaining access to all of you in the way that they have me. Again, if I can stop just one of you from having to learn the hard way as I have then my time spent writing this post was worth it.

Good luck, whichever path you choose.

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Hm… interesting. For the sake of discussion, assuming that they are real demons and that there is a god and all that, wouldn’t there be ways to protect oneself from these “attacks”?

Also, do you think any event in your life may have “caused” that creepy man to appear?

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Hey there, Nameless One. I believe that there is only one way to prevent these attacks from happening at all and so far I haven’t had the strength to do it for any longer than 2 or 3 weeks at a time. I believe you must live completely sin free in order to get them to stop, cause at the times in my life where I was living 100% sin free I didn’t have any attacks. However, I am far from perfect and struggle with my inner carnal man so the doorway has stayed open. Despite the fact I sin on a normal basis though, Jesus always pulls me out of these attacks within just seconds of calling out his name. Thank goodness he’s so merciful.

I have thought about your second question a lot and believe that lucid dreaming and astral projection were the only things I could have done which may have brought on the appearance of the old man and the subsequent demonic invasions.

Great questions though.

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Nice reflections there, I would say that many events during summer, both astrally and IWL have been similar to yours, but not that demons have activelly tried to attack me, but they have made me turn away from good things during autumn, I dont feel for publically talking about my experiences than what I already said so for my part it is too late to not take that path you tried to prevent people from taking.

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Not to cause any disrespect, Darxide, but it may be that your warning could cause more harm than good.

Regardless of whether or not what is happening to you is “real”, and I don’t mean to disregard your beliefs - if it’s real to you, or if it’s real to anyone else, that’s all that matters - by posting a detailed outline of what has happened to you someone could read it and have it happen to them. Basically, your description could cause someone to have similar frequent events of terror.

Personally, I don’t know if what is happening to you is caused by something supernatural or not (I’m agnostic, so I believe it’s fair chance for both outcomes), but I do believe that just by reading this there’s a chance that something along these lines could happen to me. Truthfully, I’m less worried about this actually happening to me than I am about fearing it could happen to me.

Describing these events that happened to you in such detail and passionately stating that lucid dreaming or things similar caused this to happen could psychologically affect others. While I’m not a psychologist I’ve observed this happening to me (being told something and it inadvertently becoming true, like a placebo effect; also I’m sort of a hypochondriac), and have done some study on it (look up the Labeling Theory; while not exactly the same thing it expresses what I mean quite clearly). Simply put, I’ve read your recount, and, since I lucid dream, it’s now a very good possibility something similar could happen to me.

Perhaps I’m being a little over reactive to this, but I just thought I’d mention it. Still you put a disclaimer in the beginning so if anything does happen… well… Curiosity killed the cat… and I was a cat in this morning’s dreams…

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You make a fair point there, Scipio. The power of suggestion is very real and that could potentially happen. However, how does one explain the fact that this happened to me without hearing or reading anyone else’s identical stories until after the fact? It’s happened to hundreds if not thousands of us so far and, as far as I am aware of, none of us were pre-exposed to the concept before the occurence.

Still a good point though.

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Exactly what you’ve described. dreamstudies.org/2010/02/26/spir … paralysis/
It is normal, but probably new for you.

Sleep Paralysis Report: tinyurl.com/km9h5hq
(tinyurl because the forum was giving me an issue with links…)

This is also worth watching. youtube.com/watch?v=O2hO4_UEe-4
Semi-related but interesting.

I don’t often post these things on SP because it can scare new people. :tongue:
Lucid dreaming did not cause these experiences; sleep paralysis did. The only thing “not normal” about your experience was the frequency of the SP, and for that you should take a look at medications, anxiety level, amount of sleep, or if there is a history of psychiatric conditions in the family. Even if there is not, it may be worth seeing a doctor.

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[color=olive]In advance I apologize for the bad grammar and terrible typos in some of the referenced DJs or any past entries that I didn’t get to redo.

Off hand I recall demons noticeably trending in my dreams around the time I first started recording on LD4all, I believe starting with the demonic clown. (Entry & sketch here ). I’ve been encountering, hunting, slaying them to this day, both individually and in numbers getting lucky with The Legion (Two Part Post/Dream).
There are more entries in my signature, DJ V1 and V2. And a couple other recall sketches involving entities or aftermath from encounters, like the vivid Bloody Mary Dream.

Recently…
A suit…More alive and conscious that others huh…? I may have encountered a proxy of some sort who tried to introduce me to someone, but on the way there I got a real uneasy feeling and the dream ended(here). In a later dream I turn down a contract for my soul here. (Oddly that was post 66 and I had about 6 dreams last night. Crazy coincidence I just noticed…And on December 6th too…Okay FTW really? :neutral: ) After that some entity decides to pose as a deceased family member making an offer (UNFORGIVEN), and I later catch a couple watching me in the distance (Entities Lurking).

Real or not, I’ll continue fighting these things off as they come. While doing so I’ll pray for your situation.[/color]

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@Wyvern - That was a great read. Very interesting. I enjoy seeing how science usually attempts to explain spiritual phenomenon. :razz: All joking aside, what happened to me was very real. Again, I’ve been dealing with dream characters and lucid dreaming for over 9 years now. I am familiar with the expectation affect, but it holds no precedence in the state of sleep paralysis. For example, I cannot make a pretty woman appear by expecting it there (believe me, I tried many many times). Also, like I mentioned, I attempted holding my breath, shaking myself awake and calling out for help to my mom and dad with the full expectation that those actions would wake me up, but they did not.

I understand it’s hard to believe actual demons are really tormenting people in their sleep, but it’s something you really have to experience for as long of a period as I have and to the extent that I have in order to truly see what’s going on. These demons have done and said things to me that I would have not been able to conjure up in my own head with my own level of intelligence. In other words, they seem vastly superior in intellect to myself, which negates any possibility of them being animated by my subconscious expectations (ala dream characters). In fact, there have been a few occasions where they used words that weren’t in my vocabulary that I had to look up later or spoke different languages all together. In one specific occurence, a less hostile demon asked me to write down a song when I woke up from the experience and then proceeded to sing it for me. It rhymed and had deep meaning and everything.

This is something that requires prolonged personal experience to believe, but everyone I have found that has been through what I have and to the extent that I have is a believer now. That should speak volumes. ;]

Also, this same horrific phenomenon has been happening to people who tampered with DIFFERENT aspects of the occult than I have, that have nothing to do with cultivating consciousness in sleep paralysis. For example, this happens to people who get involved with tarot, ouija boarding, psychic mediums, free hand writing, magick (white or black), etc. Something about occult practices just allows these entities to gain dominion over you and that includes when you pass through the natural biological period of sleep paralysis each night.

@Koharo - Holy smokes those are some intense dreams! Keep up the good fight, mate. :cheesy: I appreciate the prayers.

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God I’m so curious as to what they said, but I don’t really know if I can ask since I guess most of it probably wasn’t very nice. Any examples of the words you had to look up, the languages, their intelligence, or the song? Any concepts you couldn’t understand?

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Hi, Darxide! :wave:

It’s nice to see you post here but I have to say what’s on my mind…

I’m really sad when I see someone turns to religion. As you said you were not believer but those experiences made out of you one, right?!

Many people do the same, they become “real believers” after something(mostly not nice things) happen to them, although there are people that became believers because of different things - might even say nice things.

It’s funny to me how all those believers put their faith in someone else before them self. As you do. I mean in that moment of terror when you cry out for jesus all your terror practically stopped. And now you believe that jesus helped you fight of those demons. Right?!

In religion we mostly find comfort and strength. But what bothers me is that we people put to much effort in religion, gods and who knows what. My main question is: Didn’t you stopped those demons. Didn’t that strength and power over them came from you. Aren’t you the powerful being?! Why all that credit to give to something imaginative?!

Well to make it short all I’m saying is that we have the strength to do amazing things. When you realize that there is no need for religions or gods…

This sentence stood out to me! If you do believe in god and christianity couldn’t consciousness in sleep also open doors to god? to heaven?! Is there only a terror?!

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Sorry but I have to chime in here with dB_FTS, lucid dreaming is all about facing your fears and overcoming them, standing up to the big ugly monsters and realizing YOU are the most powerful thing there! This is how many people learn to lucid dream in the first place via recurring nightmares. Even if the being you encounter is a real entity it holds no more power over you than you do over it in that moment. The power is perception based - whatever ‘tricks’ you employ. That is the nature of the dream/astral realm it is largely fantasy-driven, the toughest fears to face are your own and usually buried deep within you.

On the other hand, I am glad you were able to be saved by Jesus and you now have a ‘way out’, but is being forced awake from your lucid dreams conductive or productive? something tells me you should be aiming higher. :angel_fly:

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Oh, I’ve yet to be able to control SP either. Fears can be deeply rooted and that’s often where the images/sounds come from. Our subconscious expectations rather than our conscious ones.

When you called out to Jesus to help you, could it have been that the SP was ending at that point anyway? Or perhaps at a subconscious level, you felt he would help? In any case, the fact that it was effective in that moment would only increase the expectation of it being effective the next times.

You would be surprised at how much information we actually do retain. It could be that you’ve heard or read the words before in passing and retained it without realizing. I’ve used my dreams to review Statistics for a test. Had the material with me in the dream and had extra study time. :tongue:
And I can’t tell you how many times I’ve heard people saying how they “heard the most amazing music” in their dreams but couldn’t remember it now/didn’t know how to write it. Dreams and even SP are a fantastic medium for creativity. I use it for composing myself, and I’ve even heard meaningful poetry in my SP.

Would appreciate if you didn’t group lucid dreaming with occult practices. Some of us get it naturally. The only thing that separates lucid dreaming from non conscious dreaming is the awareness that we are in a dream. There is nothing occult about that.
You are warning people against lucid dreaming, but the culprit here is still the sleep paralysis. (which again, I think you should see a doctor about. Have you done that? I bet not.)

And gee, you’ve been into this for 9 years and myself my whole life, it’s a wonder why I haven’t been attacked yet, you know, even after all the terribly sinful things I use my dreams to do! :peek:
Correlation does not equal causation.

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I’m new here so sorry if I’m stepping on sensitive ground here.
I’ve been a vivid dreamer for a long time now and always have wondered where dreams come from. I’m increasingly aware during my dreams though I’m more of an observer most of the time.

I can relate to what you experienced with being attacked by demons, just never before in the way you have before/during waking. In the past I had played with the Ouija board for a long time, another door best left locked. I fully regret that time frame.

I believe in Jesus Christ and follow his example to the best that I can, although I am clearly imperfect. Usually I pray before I go to sleep and ask that he guides me to do god’s will.

I’m very curious about the events that took place when Jesus would end your suffering, or any more that you have written- sorry to pry into your sacred experience… I would really love to hear as I was rescued from an untimely death from drowning so perhaps something would match up?

As I said I’m new here and don’t know where to look and can’t see anyone’s profile yet :meh:

Do you suppose all of our dreams are influenced by evils?

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There’s really only one thing that I can officially contribute to this thread.

I’m a schizo. An MP one at that.
I have things introduced to me that by no means have I ever encountered, seen, or even been hinted to by any source other than my own head…

So using the line of “I’ve never been exposed to anything like this before”, is invalid.

I very very recently learned a new definition of “curse”. A curse is one that we place on ourselves by hearing the words, and seeing sites shown to us by others. We take those in, and connect with them. Hold them too closely.

Is it possible, that as soon as you had an overwhelming nightmare, possibly traumatizing, that inside you embraced it, and put this curse upon yourself?

You have a story of bad experiences. And it’s unfortunate. But the reality is: Everyone has a bad story about something, and everyone will want to say the same thing you are saying here. It may relate to many many others, on extreme levels, but the reality is, it is not universal. There are people who get involved with religeon and have nirvana/serenity type experiences, full of peace and tranquility, while others get attacked by demons, and shadows. Encouraging other’s to stay away from “all is possible”, is a poor choice.

It’s true that getting onto a plane could result in your death if it crashes. But that is not a reason to encourage people to not board the plane, in order to get the places they wish and/or need to get to.

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I believe in power of the mind. So in my opinion you experience what you create within your own mind. Of course, it all depends on how good you are with controlling this “setting” you create within your mind.

Some are more advanced then the others, some are more susceptible then others to different stimuli which again can made different results from person to person.

I do not believe that there are such things as demons or beings of something third because we created those labels and we have need to label everything specially things we can’t understand. Though I do believe in good and bad which are the the source of ours gods, angels, demons, shadows and such.

Now again those stimuli I mentioned will reflect different from person to person. Some may see angels where other sees demons and so on and on. It’s us who need to create utopia within our minds to banish negative thoughts which are equal to demons, devil, shadow people and such.

If one has calm and balanced mind I believe that he can’t experience bad things, even when bad things happen, because they will balanced mind can change that situation into something good, or at least in bad situation find some good. Again there is label for those people = optimists.

It’s all in our mind… :content:

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I’m not here to judge other people’s perceptions, I hope it doesn’t sound like I am.
I just know that in my life when something, anything, takes the “front seat” in my life over top of what I’m actually here to do
(you be the judge of what your purpose is)

then that becomes a negative influence whether I love that thing or not. There are many examples in the waking world- Food, sensuality, gaming, work etc.
I’ve never experienced SP before so I can’t speak on that.

Sure we all can do whatever we want and often our personal experiences will be different.
Just like how medicines effect people differently and there are warnings on the label of side effects or even sometimes death warnings. That doesn’t mean each and every person will experience any side effect or death while on said medications.
Its kind to let us know this warning although it is an unpopular opinion.

I couldn’t stop dreaming if I wanted to, it happens every night vividly. It has for the longest time and I’m not generally a victim of circumstance. No argument, the dream world is interesting and exciting to visit places outside of our waking life. Its likely the closest that many of us will come to being in a spiritual state.

Being optimistic is great and yes we can manifest good outcomes with our own minds. Without a doubt there are also forces outside the realm of our influence which there will never be scientific evidence of. For example:

I’ve seen a ghost in my grandpa’s attic when I was in a happy and good state of mind, Ghosts were the furthest thing from my mind at that time. My whole family has seen it.
I’ve died from drowning and went to a higher place and was sent back to my body to live. My family wasn’t religious and I hadn’t been “indoctrinated” to believe in angels or even pray for that matter, I was only 9 or 10. However when i did die i still went and saw a great light that had three people with open arms waiting for me and I spoke with the voice of Jesus.

My sister was possessed during sleep because of my tampering with the Ouija board, which i did for a LONG time before that happened. She threatened to kill me in a demonic voice that was entirely not her own while breathing inward. My sister didn’t even know i was using the board or that she had spoke like that.

I believe in a spiritual place outside of the material world.I am here to be witness to that place that is outside of our perception. I won’t go further on that tangent here because i feel it would be ill received. Not going to force anyone to hear my story.
It is baffling whatever specifically caused the events in the original poster’s experience.

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As long as it doesn’t end/begin in preaching or arrogance, then I don’t believe it would be ill recieved. This isn’t a place for “religeous” discussion, but spirituality does not have to be labeled in that manner.

You may actually try posting about it in “The Cloud”. You’d have my eyes/ears.

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Its interesting as my born again christian friend has powerful views that dreams are not to be trifled with.

My experiences of sleep paralysis are quite horrific also and I wouldnt say demon attacks are abnormal parts of the SP experience(in my opinion) but every experience is subjective.

The first one I had i was convinced i was dieing as I couldnt move or shout, felt like my chest was being pushed to the bed and there was a bone cracking noise behind me as a black cloaked figure materialised behind me - worse then any knightmare I was completely paralised and could just see my girlfriend at the time as my eyes opened partially but she was fast asleep and couldnt have helped.

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It natural for some people to lucid dream, so what happens to them?