The BIG WILD topic, part XVI

Part XVI <–you are here
Part XV
Part XIV
The next parts are in the archive - you will need to login again to read those and is accessible for members only:
Part XII
Part XI
Part X
Part IX
Part VII
Part VI
Part V
Part IV
Part III
Part II
Part I

Is there anyone out there who can WILD w/o using the WBTB method?? Also I’d like advice from someone who can induce WILDs all the time, I know this is possible. I know I’m on my way to mastering this technique and I’d like any pointers from ppl who have a hi success rate.

I thought about my experience over and over again and I really think, it wasn’t a real WILD, since I had no HI whatsoever or anything else. Just out of a sudden I “rolled out”.
The point is, I’m not sure if I opened my eyes for real while trying to WILD or if I was already dreaming. I’d rather say the WILD method so to say functioned as a MILD, because I tried it 4 times during one morning and everytime it was the last thing I thought about before falling asleep.

Personally, I think that doing WILD and MILD together will bring the best results for me. Everytime I tried WILD, I dreamt of lucid dreaming and/or had false WILDs in my dreams. As long as the false WILDs work, I have no problems with them. :wink:

P.S. One funny anecdote from my LD is that at the beginning I always thought “What the hell am I doing here, of course this is real”. Gracefully RCs came to my mind to make sure.

You don’t have to do a physical movement, just a mental movement. Thus you don’t lose your SP. And as far I understand, you don’t really experience SP indeed, just a body numbness, cause if it was a SP you couldn’t move and “lose” it). By the way, what kind of HH do you experience, as you don’t have HI and auditory HH?

It didn’t help. I did the in the nose, out the mouth thing, and just started losing my consciousness at some point, then eventually I fell asleep completely. :sad:

So, if I get the numbness, and do some kind of mental movement, the dream will begin? What mental movement is it?

rarely ill get auditory (usually just white noise) but more often than not ill get kinesthetic.

im not sure if this counts as HI or not becuase i dont really “see” anything, but when i let my mind wander, a storyline goes on in my head and i once just entered a dream by letting that play out…unfortunately, i didnt realize that i had finally entered a dream and never became lucid (someone woke me up so i knew that i was dreaming). i guess thats kinda like an unintentional VILD.

I’m developing my own technique for WILD because I could not find truly interesting examples. Can anyone point me to some, there are so much WILD topics.

Here is the one I’ve developed after the second attempt.

Its a combination of several buddhist traditions I suppose, I’m only formally acquanted with vipassana, others are thought out by myself.

Note, if your thoughts wander of “note” them by naming and if your capable of it just “see” it with your mind or “note something else”, for example if you have ear plugs like me and one ears is itchy, try to focus on the other ear and look if there is something itchy there. Also if you don’t have earplugs try to search for your heart beat. This should not become a custom, the tric is that you don’t get distracted by intensifying your itches or pains. Also if you have angst/anxiety or othere emotions try to comprehend the whole by observing it and if you can’t give it a name, in my opinion you should only name it if you find something new about it and only observe it if you already noticed it before.

First try to be still for 5 minutes and let your conscious grow if it starts to do this(not to much, just feel confortable and go to 2), if your distracted do the thing noted above. The tric is that you come into controll and not your preconscious.
Second concentrate on the inner and outer flow of air in your nostrils. If this gets intense and your hooked up onto your nostrils you go to the next step
Third, you begin counting if everything is right and because your good concentration you’ve forgotten (like in a dream) to notice things in your body like breathing and you start counting with “1,2,3” for me my body was within 7 counts a total consciousness! It was if though my whole consciousnesness overlapped my body! and then it induced tintling in all my body (besides my head)

The last step I still have no clue about but I suppose I will try it another time. This last step is meditation and coming to understand anxiety and getting rid of this. I want to achieve this through meditation because I don’t have better idea’s.

Anyone better suggestions for this anxiety? I observe it already as though the wanting to decrease the size of consciousness but if I observe it not only anxiety go’s away but also my body awakens.

Okay, I’m having quite a big problem with WILding now. Everytime I’m somehow close, my eyelids start to open automatically. And I’m sure they do this for real, because I try to open them and realise they’re already open.
Obviously I have to keep them closed, but then I’m not relaxed anymore and won’t feel/see anything I suppose!?

a couple questions…

is there any way to ensure that you get HI or HH when you try to WILD? for some reason i dont seem to get it every time and id like to because i find it easier to WILD that way.

also, is there a way to fall asleep faster on my back? will practice make it easier? i find that i can only get far in WILD on my back but not on my side or stomach, but i have trouble making my body fall asleep on my back…if that makes any sense…it makes sense to me at least

Hello everyone :happy: ! i have this problem with WBTB/WILD. i have posted this in my dream diary asking for help but sadly :sad: hardly anyone replies (thanks to those who have :ok: ). Anyway here is what happened:

Several times i have woken up at night, and when going back to sleep i decided i would try WBTB/WILD. However the same thing stops me from going anywhere with wild. my brain is too stimulated and i see LOADS of HI swirling around way :clown: . I end up not getting anysleep. Mind you, i am relaxed during this process.

Another thing that happens when i try WBTB/WILD spontaneously in the middle of the night along with too much HI, is the fact that after a while, my body starts to hurt because of the numbness. So I end up having too move my body and give up.

Any suggestions, advice or similair experiences? Please post them here i will really appreciate it.

Yes, it’s a rather common beginner problem (not so common indeed, but I heard this many times on the forum). Just don’t worry and continue practising. It will disappear with experience. I have the feeeling that it happens when you have bright phosphenes (the little fuzzy bright dots you see eyes closed), so sometimes it gives an impression that your eyes are open cause you see light… and you open your eyes. :sad:

You should have them evey night cause when you fall asleep, you go into the hypnagogic state, so you have HH.

Yes, it makes sense. I’ve the same problem cause it’s not my usual sleeping position. :cry: I’m sorry but I’ve no solution.

Are they HI or phosphenes? I had very coloured and textured phosphenes sometimes when I do WBTB and it’s very pretty! I love this! :happy: Now don’t let them disturb you and focus on your pratice.

It’s a very common beginner relaxation problem. I’ve read twive on the forum this interesting hypothesis that your brain, when you’re on the verge of falling asleep, sends to your body a little pain to verify if it is already sleeping. If you move, then it thinks “Oops! He’s not asleep”. And you’re awake. But if you don’t move, it is fooled and it disconnects all so that you fall asleep. So don’t move and try to go through this state. :smile:

Woa That is really interesting! :hmmm: Thanks for answering this question.

Well they are mostly HI…so how can i focus on my practice if all my HI is messed up and confused :confused: ? Is that what u mean by focus on your practice? :confused:

For instance, if your WILD method is counting, don’t get disturb by those phosphenes and just keep up counting.

OK I’ve been able to use the WILD tech 4 times succesfully in about 2 and a half weeks since my 1st. All of my successes were used in combination w/ the WBTB technique. Last night I tried the same thing but when I went into SP
The vibrations/noises we’re getting really really intense after about a minute or 2 into it and I started getting scared then I tryed to clap my hands to wake up then it seemed like a train wreck happened in my head (it was so loud it hurt)… this was pretty disturbing.
I tried reassuring myself that these things happen every night whether conscious or not. I used to think I saw demons for 4 yeas straight. I’ve read that HHs lead alot of ppl into believing this is happening. I thought I overcame this fear after learning about it and my succesful WILDs. I don’t open my eyes in SP anymore and i haven’t seen anyhing scary in over a year. A part of me still thinks that it was actually some demon or evil spirit etc tormenting me instead of just some halucination… that alot of ppl coincidentally experience the exact same thing.
Any insight or help would be great.

Loud imaginary noises aren’t uncommon. In fact, that’s how I usually get into a WILD. It serves me as an audible cue, and when it fades away, I’m almost always asleep.

I know that loud noises, halucinations , vibrations and other tactile feelings are all common in SP…but to the point when it is painful!? I seriously doubt my body goes through that naturally each night when I’m about to go to sleep or i would most definately never fall asleep. I would like to know why when ppl from all over the world have HH they consistently have the exact same halucinations. Specifically ones where an evil demon like entity that wants to harm them is involved. That just a coincidence!? :eek: I dont think so but, I’m sure there is a logical explanation for this… I hope. When I use the WBTB and WILD method together this usually (not 100% of the time)makes all the SP vibrations noises halucinations etc much less intense and drawn out. Though I do want to get to the point where I can WILD when first going to sleep. Anyone got any tricks to avoid or dilude all these nasty SP symptoms?

Um. Can’t help you about any “evil demons”, 'cause I don’t believe in them. But yes. The third time I had that kind of HH, it seemed deafening. The noises certainly don’t happen every time you fall asleep, but the SP does.

Hi Toxikfox,

I think this topic should be better located in the BIG SP/Old Hag topic cause it’s not really related with WILD methods but with SP hallucinations and the fear they may generate. Moreover, it’s hidden into the WILD topic, so that experienced SP’ed people who look at the BIG SP topic are unlikely to see it here. May I merge it to the BIG SP topic?

About the painful vibrations, they have been reproduced in sleep laboratories by exciting some brain parts with magnetic fields. Some people here told they were related with delta brain waves. I can’t ensure you that the vibes which have been created in laboratories are exactly the same that SP’ed people experience. Now I’ve experience them once in a DILD (I wanted to verify what a friend of mine, who is subject to the SP trouble and believed in demons, experienced). OK. They are very annoying. Experienced SP’ed people say they learnt to avoid them by entering a LD. When you enter a LD, for instance by rolling mentally out of you bed, they become smoother or they disappear.

About believing in demons attacking you during SP, I think it’s the better way of becoming paranoid. :tongue: It’s mainly the same experience that everybody can have during big nightmares. Imagine a stressed person who gets nightmares due to WL stress and supposes he gets attacked by demons during sleep and you can quickly guess the result. Many SP’ed people got paranoid because they believed they were abducted by aliens or something like that. When they were explained by psychiatrists or LD’ers that it was just HH and they had not to fear, they went better. Moreover, just like you can experience in LD’s, emotions create the events. Most of the time, if you’re afraid, there will be a monster. It will disappear if you change your emotion. (It doesn’t work exactly like that, cause there is often a lapse of time and fear will not create automatically a monster, but it’s a good approximation).

I’m determined to make this WILD thing happen for me once and for all! I’m motivated finally (I usually want to do it but don’t persevere) and my results so far are these:

  1. 1st night: pleased with my small results so far, body started feeling numb, at least the upper half (when this happened I felt like, hey, something’s happening! whee!), I could still kind of hear my boyfriend out in the living room watching TV, tried to ignore it and concentrate on my inner self and feeling my body relax, I really felt like I was getting somewhere with the physical relaxation and proud of myself for not moving…before when I tried this, even a small itch would bother me enough to make me move but this time I ignored everything and I think I even got an itch on my leg but it was like the itch was really far away and muted…but then I started thinking, am I going to lie here with my brain awake all night? I really must get some sleep…so tried to make my brain a little more relaxed but keep control but of course I failed because my brain fell asleep and no lucidity. But I’m happy with my results and now I know if I keep practicing, I can only improve my skills! :content:

  2. 2nd night, was too tired and fell right asleep when my head hit the pillow. :tongue:

  3. So tonight (3rd night) I’m going to bed earlier (as soon as I’m done here!) so I can try it again and this time I’m shutting the bedroom door to block out the TV-watching boyfriend and I’m also going to turn on the fan in the bedroom for some white noise. If I’m as motivated as I think I finally am and actually stick with it, I’ll be posting my results here periodically and hopefully I’ll have good results and can give hope to others. If I can achieve it, anyone can, because I’ve been here for a while with only one instance of lucidity (DILD). :content:

I was trying to do a WILD last night and I tryed to create a portal to my dream and walked through it. While I’m still councious I make this portal the craziest ride and soon my eyes are like going through REM or something. Then I opened my eyes because of that and failed. I’ll try again tonight. Is it good to eperience REM while your still concious?

OMG! :content:
Last night I nearly got a WILD! I’d just woken up from about 6 hrs of sleep, then I closed my eyes for a while and my body fell asleep. I think I got to the paralization part, but I was sort of still able to move if I wanted (but I didn’t). My eyes were also not closed properly, they could close but they wern’t relaxed like that and I actully opened my eyes twice. I was counting each breath I made and listened to the buzzing in my ears (though it never really got louder) and I could think about flying and stuff, and it was like a dream but I couldn’t actully see it, but just imagine it. I eventually just turned over, without getting to the dream state because I forgot what I was supposed to do :sad:

Is that what you’re supposed to do, or was that something else?